[M_Beorn]

Ok, this might be a silly question to some of you, and I can see the automatic replys of why would you want to, but here it goes.

Can or should one dress down the formal attire using a Brian Boru or PC jacket? In other words, can one still wear the jacket slightly less formalized with out a tux shirt and black tie?

Thanks,

[HeathBar]

Let me ask you this question. Would you wear a tailcoat or a mess dress jacket in a non formal setting? I would not. These are formal jackets meant to be worn with black or white tie. But can you wear it in a non-formal setting? Sure, no one is going to stop you. But those "in the know" will just be polite and keep their comments to themselves.

This is why a black Argyll or similar cut of jacket is the best option if you are only going to have one jacket.

[BEEDEE]

Originally Posted by M_Beorn

Ok, this might be a silly question to some of you, and I can see the automatic replys of why would you want to, but here it goes.

Can or should one dress down the formal attire using a Brian Boru or PC jacket? In other words, can one still wear the jacket slightly less formalized with out a tux shirt and black tie?

Thanks,

IMHO - NO!!!!! Get an Argyll if you want more versitility.

Brian

[Panache]

Originally Posted by BEEDEE

IMHO - NO!!!!! Get an Argyll if you want more versitility.

Brian

The Brian Boru, Prince Charlie Coatee, and Regulation doublet are all "one trick ponies". They only do one thing, and that is black tie formal (which they do very well).

If you want the ability to dress up or down follow Brian's suggestion and go with the black argyll.

Take a look at this thread to see how they can be dressed up or down

http://www.xmarksthescot.com/forum/1...888/index.html

Spefically look at my photos #7 and #8 to see how the argyll jacket can move up or down in formality

Hope this was of help

Cheers

Jamie

[Bugbear]

Hmmm, I've seen Phill post that the Sheriffmuir can be dressed down a bit, but I'm not sure how much he meant. Probably not below black tie.

* Oh, Panache does have another formal jacket, PC-like. I thought there was another jacket, but I couldn't remember what it was.

[MacLowlife]

Your question has two contradictory answers, each legitimate and correct:
1) NO, you can't dress down a tuxedo. Ever. No Way. No How.
and
2) Obviously, you can dress anything up or down with accessories. A man in a tuxedo with a long tie is less dressed up than a man in a tuxedo with a black bow tie. A colored bow tie is less dressy. No tie is less dressy. A turtleneck is less dressy. A dinner jacket and jeans ( or cowboy boots, or both) may be less dressy. Sneakers are less dressy. These things are not CORRECT, but they are the privilege of the owner of the clothes. For people who only own one kilt jacket and don't have the money to get another one, it is probably better to be incorrect ( and warm) than to go without.

This will offend a lot of people, but here goes: The average member of the US public is unfamiliar with the kilt and what is correct wear with it. That member of the public is not going to notice that the slightly odd jacket you are wearing surely looks too dressy for the surroundings. He or she is going to notice YOUR KILT. If you are in a situation that calls for a kilt and a jacket, but not black tie, you may wear your BB or PC without a black tie. People who know will probably consider you out of uniform, improperly dressed, etc. But one or two of them will stop and think that you are merely being creative.

Wearing socks or not, wearing a tie or not, wearing a suit coat without its mated trousers, wearing a button-down collar shirt with certain jackets- these are all things people do every day, despite opinion ( rules) to the contrary. Think of movie stars in shorts, jerseys, jogging suits, pajamas. Look at old movies where even bums wore suits- and look at millionaires who never wear a necktie. Things change and they do because people are sometimes forced to improvise, or because someone with power and influence decides to.

If there were no change, we would all be in great kilts ( or togas or animal skins) and everybody else would be in knee breeches.

[M_Beorn]

OK, I kinda knew the answer before I posted it, but hey if you don't ask, you'll never really know.

Thanks for suggestions, I really should be thinking about another less formal jacket.

Cheers,

[Bugbear]

Originally Posted by MacLowlife

... we would all be in great kilts ( or togas or animal skins) and everybody else would be in knee breeches.

Not that anything is wrong with those... especially the knee breeches.

[CMcG]

Originally Posted by M_Beorn

<snip>
Can or should one dress down the formal attire using a Brian Boru or PC jacket? <snip>

Yes you can. As an example, I'm including a photo of Gerard Butler doing just what you ask on the red carpet for some event or other. I think he could have gone even further and ditched the three button waistcoat for a nice, big, shiny, belt buckle. This falls under breaking fashion "rules" in favor of style.

Whether or not you should do such a thing is another story. It certainly would not follow convention and the kilt police might arrest you! As others have mentioned an argyll is much more flexible for dressing up or down and remaining within established mores.

[OC Richard]

Originally Posted by M_Beorn

Can or should one dress down the formal attire using a PC jacket? In other words, can one still wear the jacket slightly less formalized without a tux shirt and black tie?

I have to begin with my usual caveat that I've dropped in to this forum after over 30 years in the Pipe Band world...

Back in the late 1970's and early 1980's it was quite a fad for Pipe Bands to wear PCs but with normal shirts and long neckties, and the currently popular Arran-knit offwhite kilt hose and ghillies... an odd blend of Evening Dress and Day Dress if you like.

So, this sort of thing doesn't jar the eye of pipers who were around at that time.

It looked like this c1980:



I don't know if any pipe bands dress like this anymore...if they did so it would look terribly out of date.

About Gerard Butler, note that it's common in Hollywood for stars to wear tuxedos with no necktie, with a plain black t-shirt, etc etc. What I was wondering is, where are his flashes?

Wasn't he in Dear Franky? One of my favourite Scottish films!