[Jock Scot]

Originally Posted by Zardoz

No, the Belle was the real deal;
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Memphis_Belle_(aircraft)

Right, thank you for that. Credit must be rightfully given to those to whom it is due.

[MacMillan of Rathdown]

Movies are meant to entertain. If they inform, well and good-- but that's not their intended purpose. In the more than 100 years Hollywood-- and everyone else-- has been making movies some of those films have been accurate down to the last button. Some haven't. Das Boot is an excellent example of accuracy. Well done, Germany. In The Charge of the Light Brigade about the only fact the British got right was the one about there actually being a Crimean War. As a history lesson it's right up there with the Erroll Flynn version made thirty years earlier in California which, by the way, is a lot more entertaining. Saving Private Ryan and Band of Brothers were both entertaining and historically accurate, as was Gettysburg-- even if Martin Sheen did look more like a talking moon-pie than Robert E. Lee.

In the motion picture industry there is a saying: "If you want history, learn to read". Otherwise, go to the movies.

[thescot]

Originally Posted by Zardoz

No, the Belle was the real deal;
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Memphis_Belle_(aircraft)

You can see the Belle in Memphis, Tennessee if you like. I prefer it ( and the Pink Palace) to Graceland.

[Lachlan09]

Originally Posted by cajunscot

But, in fairness, has Pinewood Studios re-written history for a good story, such as U-571, which claimed that the Americans captured an Naval Enigma machine? In reality, it was the crew of HMS Bulldog that did so.

Or for that matter, what about Erroll Flynn & the Yanks single-handedly taking Burma? The 14th Army squaddies in India rioted after seeing that travesty in Objective Burma!

T.

I know what you mean. My dad operated in Burma with SOE Force 136 and in 1945 saw this Erroll Flynn epic in an Indian cinema. Even now "Objective Burma" on TV is likely to get the instant switch-off treatment. I must admit, I watched it purely in interest at the authentic US WW2 paratroop uniforms.

Mad Mitch would be an idea (my hero !) but a film about the Argylls in Aden in '67 "The Summer of Love" would be likely to instigate a Fatwa !

[Lachlan09]

Talking about Argylls, hopefully this next part isn’t controversial for X-Marks’ Mods. A year or two ago, I was on the website of the Jim Crow Museum, an African-American website which looks at black history in America. In an international section, an article was dedicated to Mad Mitch and the Argylls in Aden in 1967. The article claimed that the Jocks got a bit rough with the local arab population (that was true, I remember British news film of local suspects being ushered on by the well-aimed toe-caps of Boots, DMS, Argyll Jocks for the use of).

But the article also claimed that whenever Argylls shot arabs (FLOSY etc terrorists), a fashion arose of sporting enameled Robertson’s Golly pin-badges on their breast pockets. Robertson’s is (or was) a Dundee company which makes marmalades, jams and preserves. Their logo of many years’ standing was a traditional minstrel-type black-face golliwog toy character with a broad red-lipped smile (The Robertson’s Golly) and each jar had a paper cut-out token on the back. Cut out so many of these paper logos and you send off for any one of a range of nicely enameled metal golly badge figures. One of them was even a bagpiper.

I've wondered if the Jim Crow claim was correct or was a fabrication. At the back of my mind is the feeling it was at least true to some degree.

[MacMillan of Rathdown]

When I grew up I was taught that "Africa starts at the Alps and the Wogs begin at Calais"-- was this a prejudicial view of the ethnic geo-politic of a post-imperial world? Sure, it you want it to be.

Did Argylls pin Gollies on their shirts in Aden? Sure, if you want to believe it. Where they got their jam-jar Gollies is another matter; I rather doubt they were available from the NAAFI.

At the end of the day that's how men behave when dealing with the reality of war-- nice, politically correct, sentiments get flushed right down the pan. War hardens men, and hard men win wars. As a matter of interest did the Jim Crow site mention the atrocities committed by the Arabs against the British in Aden? At the back of my mind is the feeling they didn't.

For the true story of the gollywog pin go to: http://www.britains-smallwars.com/Ad...astHours2.html

[Redshank]

"now if some chap starts throwing grenades or shooting pisstols, we shall kill him, simple as that" quote from Lieutenant Colonel Colin Campbell Mitchell, whilst on actice service in Aden.

The documentary attached to the Mad Mitch link takes a wee while to download, but the wait is well worth it, and sheds light on the attitudes of the times

http://www.argylls1945to1971.co.uk/AandSH_Mad_Mitch.htm

[cajunscot]

Originally Posted by Redshank

"now if some chap starts throwing grenades or shooting pisstols, we shall kill him, simple as that" quote from Lieutenant Colonel Colin Campbell Mitchell, whilst on actice service in Aden.

The documentary attached to the Mad Mitch link takes a wee while to download, but the wait is well worth it, and sheds light on the attitudes of the times

http://www.argylls1945to1971.co.uk/AandSH_Mad_Mitch.htm

Chris,

Many thanks for passing that along! It is indeed well worth the wait to download.

T.

[Lachlan09]

When I was a boy in the 1960's, I had a number of Robertsons Golly badges, including a piper, guitar player, footballer etc. I never saw it as racist. Gollies looked happy and made me feel good. I think squaddies could get the badges from home via BFPO.

Colin Mitchell and the Argylls did what they had to do. I fully support their actions. FLOSY gunmen in Crater were sniping at British troops at will then diving into alleyways and hiding in mosques, where they thought British troops wouldn’t dare go. But unknown to them, the Argylls placed their own snipers in high vantage points at night and lay doggo until the terrorists appeared to ambush British troops. They then popped the arab gunmen before they could get to the mosques. Mitchell also had a great relationship with the press with unusual mutual trust and they agreed to report by his rules in return for him being honest with them whenever possible.

The Aden police chief incident is still one of my favourite stories, when for the first early morning symbolic entry into Crater, Mitchell drove the first Land Rover behind Pipe Major Kenny Robson playing on foot, with the unwilling, untrustworthy Arab police chief at Mitchell’s side. If arabs started shooting, the police chief would get hit too. Also in the Land Rover were 2 Argylls with orders to shoot the police chief if he tried any funny business. Of course, the previous night, after arab beddy-byes time, Mitchell had quietly sneaked into Crater a force of Argyll snipers and MGs who took over the all the high vantage points, ready to take out terrorists when they appeared. So when the arabs woke to the sound of Argyll pipes, the Argylls were in control of Crater. Argyll Law had arrived !!!

As for the Jim Crow site, I’m sure they have their own spin agenda.