X Marks the Scot - An on-line community of kilt wearers.

   X Marks Partners - (Go to the Partners Dedicated Forums )
USA Kilts website Freedom Kilts website Scotweb websiten Burnetts and Struth website The Scottish Trading Company
Xmarks advertising information Celtic Croft website Xmarks advertising information Celtic Corner website Xmarks advertising information

User Tag List

Page 1 of 2 12 LastLast
Results 1 to 10 of 11
  1. #1
    Join Date
    10th January 19
    Location
    Houston, Texas
    Posts
    214
    Mentioned
    2 Post(s)
    Tagged
    0 Thread(s)

    Question Seeking opinions: lowlander or highlander?

    The family genealogists have been unable to track my great x2 grandfather before he immigrated to Canada. Since his name is William Brown, searching the Scottish census turns up too many results, with no way to rule enough of them out. It's unlikely that we'll be able to get a yDNA test (particularly from my cousin, the conspiracy theorist).

    Given the Brown surname, he could be either a lowlander or highlander. From what I can tell, there is a concentration of Browns/Brouns in the lowlands, such as Clan Broun in East Lothian. There is also a concentration of Browns in the highlands, such as the Brown sept of Clan Lamont and the Brown sept of Clan MacMillan in the Cowal peninsula.

    Based on what details we have, I'm wondering if it's possible to determine that it's somewhat more likely that he is one, rather than the other.

    Name: William Brown
    Year of Birth: 1815-1820
    Country of Birth: Scotland
    Emigrated to: Canada
    Year of Emigration: 1851-1856
    Occupation (in Canada): Laborer

    At the time he emigrated from Scotland, he was a bachelor. It's unknown whether he would have been traveling alone.

    Contemporaneously, Scotland was going through both the Second Highland Clearance and the West Highland Potato Famine. But we have no information whether that was the reason for his departure from Scotland. I'm not aware whether there was a comparable movement from the lowlands during those years. I believe the Scottish Lowland Clearance had ended before the 1850s.

    Obviously, he could be from anywhere in Scotland. But based on the information above, would you think William Brown was more likely to be a lowlander or a highlander?

  2. The Following User Says 'Aye' to Karl R For This Useful Post:


  3. #2
    Join Date
    21st December 05
    Location
    Hawick, Scotland
    Posts
    11,021
    Mentioned
    1 Post(s)
    Tagged
    0 Thread(s)
    Difficult one to call.
    Some of the "colour" names such as Brown, Black, White, Grey are quite common and found all over Scotland, unlike Blue which seems to be mainly found in Argyll.
    Be happy that you have Scots ancestry, whether Highland or Lowland.
    Vice-President and Regional Director for Scotland for Clan Cunningham International, and a Scottish Armiger.

  4. The Following 2 Users say 'Aye' to cessna152towser For This Useful Post:


  5. #3
    Join Date
    2nd March 11
    Location
    Scotland, Ontario, Canada
    Posts
    342
    Mentioned
    0 Post(s)
    Tagged
    0 Thread(s)
    I agree it would be very difficult to tell without more information. My surname is another very common one all over Scotland. In my case I know my Grandparents came from outside Inverness because they were still alive when I was a boy. If you did some searching on Canadian immigration websites you might find something that would state his place of birth. It is on my Grandparent's immigration records. Sites like Ancestry.ca have this type of data but I think you would need to buy and account. There is probably other places where this data is available.
    Last edited by Singlemalt; 13th January 19 at 02:44 PM.

  6. The Following User Says 'Aye' to Singlemalt For This Useful Post:


  7. #4
    Join Date
    28th May 13
    Location
    Calgary, Alberta, Canada
    Posts
    2,545
    Mentioned
    2 Post(s)
    Tagged
    0 Thread(s)
    Perhaps you are part of the “Broons”...a famous cartoon family!
    "Good judgement comes from experience, and experience
    well, that comes from poor judgement."
    A. A. Milne

  8. #5
    Join Date
    21st March 17
    Location
    San Diego, USA
    Posts
    742
    Mentioned
    0 Post(s)
    Tagged
    0 Thread(s)
    Maybe you’re a German “braun” whose family moved to Scotland, and changed it to brown before moving to Canada!

    The thing is, you really have to know the geographic location for the name to provide much info.
    Descendant of the Gillises and MacDonalds of North Morar.

  9. #6
    Join Date
    2nd May 08
    Location
    Mandurah, Western Australia
    Posts
    550
    Mentioned
    0 Post(s)
    Tagged
    0 Thread(s)
    Details of his birthplace may be on his Canadian marriage certificate.

    My great grandfather emigrated to Australia in 1853 and married in Victoria in 1855. His marriage certificate gives the couple's Scottish birthplaces and their parent's names. My great, great grandmother was also a Brown and hailed from Montrose in, then, Forfarshire.

  10. #7
    Join Date
    13th September 10
    Location
    Sacramento, CA
    Posts
    207
    Mentioned
    0 Post(s)
    Tagged
    0 Thread(s)
    Brown is a sept of Clan Douglas, which is mostly the southwest of Scotland, somewhere about Dumfries, south of Glasgow, and the central lowlands (see Douglas, UK). That knowledge might be of some use.

  11. The Following 2 Users say 'Aye' to KiltedSergeant For This Useful Post:


  12. #8
    Join Date
    2nd May 08
    Location
    Mandurah, Western Australia
    Posts
    550
    Mentioned
    0 Post(s)
    Tagged
    0 Thread(s)
    Quote Originally Posted by KiltedSergeant View Post
    Brown is a sept of Clan Douglas, which is mostly the southwest of Scotland, somewhere about Dumfries, south of Glasgow, and the central lowlands (see Douglas, UK). That knowledge might be of some use.
    It is also claimed to be a sept of Clans MacMillan, MacDonald and Lamont, which is of no help at all unless you can trace your forebears to a particular location. Furthermore, the concept of clan septs is rather fanciful - see link:

    http://www.clans-families.org/clan-septs.html
    Last edited by Bruce Scott; 16th January 19 at 03:45 PM.

  13. The Following 2 Users say 'Aye' to Bruce Scott For This Useful Post:


  14. #9
    Join Date
    10th January 19
    Location
    Houston, Texas
    Posts
    214
    Mentioned
    2 Post(s)
    Tagged
    0 Thread(s)
    Quote Originally Posted by FossilHunter View Post
    Maybe you’re a German “braun” whose family moved to Scotland, and changed it to brown before moving to Canada!
    That's interesting. I was aware of the German mass immigrations into New York colony and into Ireland. I was aware of the Scottish mass immigrations into Ireland, Canada and Australia. I've never heard of any mass immigrations of Germans into Canada.

    What can you tell me about that mass immigration?

    Quote Originally Posted by KiltedSergeant View Post
    Brown is a sept of Clan Douglas, which is mostly the southwest of Scotland, somewhere about Dumfries, south of Glasgow, and the central lowlands (see Douglas, UK). That knowledge might be of some use.
    Quote Originally Posted by Bruce Scott View Post
    It is also claimed to be a sept of Clans MacMillan, MacDonald and Lamont, which is of no help at all unless you can trace your forebears to a particular location.
    Thank you both. I was unaware that the Clan MacDonald and Clan Douglas also had Brown septs. I've also discovered (in the last day) that there's a Boyd sept of Browns.
    The information doesn't lead me to an answer to my questions, but additional relevant information is always welcome.

    Quote Originally Posted by Singlemalt View Post
    If you did some searching on Canadian immigration websites you might find something that would state his place of birth. It is on my Grandparent's immigration records.
    There wasn't any formal immigration back in the 1850s. Starting in 1803, ships sailing to North America were required to keep passenger lists ... but most of those have been lost. Here are a couple examples of what's available:
    http://www.bac-lac.gc.ca/eng/discove...?IdNumber=899&
    http://www.bac-lac.gc.ca/eng/discove...?IdNumber=900&

    As you can see from the first example, the record doesn't show the age of this William Brown. There's no way to match him up, or rule him out, as being my great x2 grandfather. In addition, even if I could confirm that this was the correct William Brown, there's no point of origin for the ship.

    In the second example, William Browne again lacks an age. This passenger record includes a point of origin and a destination ... both of which are in Ontario, Canada. I'm not entirely sure how one takes a ship from Hamilton to Preston, since Preston is straight inland from Hamilton. But that's the information available.

    I asked about broader immigration trends, because the specific information I'd prefer wasn't available.

    Quote Originally Posted by Bruce Scott View Post
    Details of his birthplace may be on his Canadian marriage certificate.
    That far back, few of the records have survived. Specifically, the disparate collections have a grand total of Canadian 36,000 birth, death and marriage records occurring between 1749 and 1917. In other words, most are missing ... including his.

    This is the sort of thing the family genealogists have already gone looking for ... specifically because there's such a wealth of information on the marriage records.

    Quote Originally Posted by cessna152towser View Post
    Be happy that you have Scots ancestry, whether Highland or Lowland.
    I suspect that you own a kilt that has a tartan which relates to your ancestry ... either a clan, or a district where your family has lived. I would also like to be able to wear a kilt that reflects my family's background.

  15. #10
    Join Date
    2nd March 11
    Location
    Scotland, Ontario, Canada
    Posts
    342
    Mentioned
    0 Post(s)
    Tagged
    0 Thread(s)
    Quote Originally Posted by FossilHunter View Post
    Maybe you’re a German “braun” whose family moved to Scotland, and changed it to brown before moving to Canada!

    The thing is, you really have to know the geographic location for the name to provide much info.
    Or a Braun who moved directly from Germany to Canada but changed the spelling to better blend in a largely English speaking society. Here is SW Ontario the cities of Kitchener and Waterloo were originally New Hamburg and New Berlin because of the large German settlement in that area. They were changed to the jingoistic British names they carry now during WW1 when all things German were quite unpopular. A lot of people of German descent also anglicized their names at this time as well.

    Brown is such a common name it will be difficult to ever know without more information.

Page 1 of 2 12 LastLast

Bookmarks

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •  

» Log in

User Name:

Password:

Not a member yet?
Register Now!
Powered by vBadvanced CMPS v4.2.0