[Drum Major]

For white tie it is easier to wear a white bow tie and white waist coat with a Prince Charlie or Regulation doublet, tartan or diced hose and dress sporran. Never wear black studs as they should be white or gold when wearing a Prince Charlie or Regulation doublet.

[JSFMACLJR]

Originally Posted by Drum Major

Never wear black studs as they should be white or gold when wearing a Prince Charlie or Regulation doublet.

Piffle! I never do wear onyx studs, but some of my mother-of-pearl studs are smoky. I always wonder where people find these rules regarding the kilt! I know full well that with white tie studs should be light in colour, but really, Drum Major, tying in specific studs with specific doublets is silly.

Furthermore:
1. the Prince Charlie coatee really isn't suitable for full dress events.
2. White Tie permits the wearing of black bow ties with Highland dress.

[Ryan Ross]

Originally Posted by JSFMACLJR

Piffle! I never do wear onyx studs, but some of my mother-of-pearl studs are smoky. I always wonder where people find these rules regarding the kilt! I know full well that with white tie studs should be light in colour, but really, Drum Major, tying in specific studs with specific doublets is silly.

Furthermore:
1. the Prince Charlie coatee really isn't suitable for full dress events.
2. White Tie permits the wearing of black bow ties with Highland dress.

Bravo for keeping it real, good Sir! I heartily agree.

[Drum Major]

Remember a Prince Charlie is a tail coat with tails cut short and the cuffs and tails have extra patches with silver buttons in lieu of the normal black buttons thus is quite suitable for wearing when gents are wearing tails. It may be worn with white tie, white studs and white waistcoat when the majority are wearing tails. If on the other hand gents are in tails and dinner suits then you can get away with black tie and waistcoat. At black tie affairs you may wear a Prince Charlie or a Black Argyle jacket with a black bow tie and studs. At more relaxed affairs I have seen people wearing a daywear tie with a Prince Charlie while others are in Black Argyle and day tie. It is easier to get away with this style as the degree of formality is reduced but not as it goes up. In many organisations wearing black studs with a white tie is a serious faux pas. You will find who your freinds are who tell you on the side or those who just let you continue.

[Wandering Bruce]

Thanks, Jamie and Glen, for all your effort! I will pass this thread on to kilted friends (and wannabes) for their edification and encouragement.

[Mike_Oettle]

My salaams to Jamie and Glen for their full range of kilt looks.
And thanks to the others who also posted pictures.
This thread has helped me a great deal in figuring out how I can wear the kilt in various circumstances.
(When I was in the regiment, there was only one style!)
I can’t wait for next year (after my daughter’s wedding) to get my first kilt and start experimenting. Pictures will follow.

Kane remarked of the red lions on the navy blue tie: “In the UK I've only ever heard it mentioned as The Lion Rampant, rampant lions are something completely different and somewhat innapropriate. That may just be the me and the few Scots I know though.”

As a heraldry buff, I come across lions in various positions all the time, and one cannot always use the stiff wording found in a formal blazon.
The arms of Scotland are: Or, a lion rampant gules, langued and armed azure, within a double tressure flory counter-flory also gules.
But it is quite acceptable to speak (or write informally) of a rampant lion, or a royal tressure.
Regards,
Mike

[James Byous]

Very nice. Great idea.

[bdkilted]

Great job guys. Of course you have jumped started the economy by showing all of these. Now we may feel we have to go out and get a few more items.

[Mike_Oettle]

Looking afresh at this thread this evening I came across this paragraph in my last post:

“Kane remarked of the red lions on the navy blue tie: ‘In the UK I've only ever heard it mentioned as The Lion Rampant, rampant lions are something completely different and somewhat innapropriate. That may just be the me and the few Scots I know though.’ ”

Several times it has struck me since I wrote that, that Kane and I were thinking on different lines. I was referring to the lion merely as one of many heraldic beasts, while he was referring specifically to the royal lion of Scotland.
But as I wrote previously, the royal arms of Scotland are a red lion rampant on gold (yellow), within a royal tressure.
The tressure is important, because it is the only difference between the Scottish quarter in the royal arms and the quarter for Fife in the arms of the Duke (until the 19th century, the Earl) of Fife.
It appears that the tressure (a charge that was already centuries old in Flemish heraldic usage) was added to the royal arms to distinguish the King’s shield from that of his cousin the Earl. (The earliest Scottish monarch to bear these arms is recalled, appropriately, as William the Lion.)
And since colours are of vital importance in heraldry, a red lion on blue is not really a symbol of Scotland. Blue might be the national colour (from the flag of St Andrew’s cross), but it is not a colour in the royal arms.
Also, heraldry does not normally permit red on blue, since it lacks adequate contrast for ready identification.
If a Scot (a native of Scotland, or someone of Scottish descent) wants to wear such a tie, who am I to stop him?
But I would not wear it, nor would I presume to wear a tie (or other garment) bearing the red lion rampant on gold (in its tressure). This would be tantamount to proclaiming that this is my coat of arms.
I might happily wear a blue tie with white saltires, since that is a symbol not of the Crown as such, but of the Scottish nation. (The flag of St Andrew is nonetheless also a royal badge.)
And, to sum up, I refer to the Scottish lion rampant as the lion of Scotland.
Were I simply to say “the [or a] lion rampant” I might be speaking of the lion in any of dozens (even thousands) of coats of arms.
It might be odd to some people that lions are to be found in the British royal arms at all (one in the Scottish quarter, three in the English). But remember that coats of arms were adopted widely across Christian Europe in the time of the Crusades.
The knights who placed lions on their arms were in many cases warriors who had come across lions in the Middle East, and who had been taught that the lion was a brave beast.
Knights from across Europe chose the lion as their symbol. They are extremely common in German and British/Irish arms, but they have their densest concentration in arms from the Low Countries.
The tressure also is a charge found in many coats of arms (although not nearly as many as have lions).
It is a diminutive of the orle (a stripe running around the inside of the shield edge, which is less than half of a bordure).
It can be single or double. A double tressure crossed by alternating fleurs de lis is generally called a royal tressure – but only if it has a Scottish significance.
Since Scottish monarchs have granted it to many individuals and to not a few royal burghs, it is often encountered.
It is the combination of the red rampant lion and the red royal tressure (placed on a gold shield) that makes the royal arms of Scotland.
Regards,
Mike

[macfhearghuis]

Wow,I would like to know where one can purchase this attire,let me know please, stunningly scot))