X Marks the Scot - An on-line community of kilt wearers.

   X Marks Partners - (Go to the Partners Dedicated Forums )
USA Kilts website Freedom Kilts website Scotweb websiten Burnetts and Struth website Celtic Croft website
Xmarks advertising information Celtic Corner website Xmarks advertising information Houston Kiltmakers Xmarks advertising information

User Tag List

Results 1 to 9 of 9
  1. #1
    Join Date
    9th January 20
    Location
    Derby England
    Posts
    2
    Mentioned
    0 Post(s)
    Tagged
    0 Thread(s)

    Cameron highlanders ww2

    Hi all thanks for taking me in, I am going to be doing a Cameron highlanders impression for my re-enactment I have managed to find an original Cameron highlanders kilt

    What I am now looking for is a vintage day sporran if anyone has onefor sale

    My warmest regards

    Chris

  2. The Following User Says 'Aye' to Rangerfranky For This Useful Post:


  3. #2
    Join Date
    10th December 06
    Location
    Toronto, Ontario, Canada
    Posts
    13,997
    Mentioned
    5 Post(s)
    Tagged
    0 Thread(s)
    from Toronto. I will suggest you look on www.ebay.co.uk for the sporran.

  4. #3
    Join Date
    15th January 19
    Location
    Lake Zurich, Illinois
    Posts
    120
    Mentioned
    0 Post(s)
    Tagged
    0 Thread(s)
    Greetings from a fellow reenactor!
    You can try ebay, or if a reproduction is suitable there is http://onlinemilitaria.net
    Are you planning on a pre or post Dunkirk impression?

  5. #4
    Join Date
    9th January 20
    Location
    Derby England
    Posts
    2
    Mentioned
    0 Post(s)
    Tagged
    0 Thread(s)



    Hi there post Dunkirk ww2 1943

  6. #5
    Join Date
    15th January 19
    Location
    Lake Zurich, Illinois
    Posts
    120
    Mentioned
    0 Post(s)
    Tagged
    0 Thread(s)
    Quote Originally Posted by Rangerfranky View Post


    Hi there post Dunkirk ww2 1943
    Okay. Are you aware that in almost all cases the Camerons turned in their kilts for Battledress trousers after the Dunkirk Evacuation? The only two exceptions I can think of are former Camerons who moved to other units, specifically Piper Bill Millin and Col. Tommy Macpherson, both highly exceptional individuals and both became Commandos. Specific unit pipers may have retained their kilts for ceremonial duties, but well behind the front.
    Are you planning a generic Camerons impression or portraying a very specific individual? If the latter, learn as much as you can about them, and find any and all photographs and documents. That is what I have done for my USMC/USN impression, where I portray my grandfather with his original uniforms and equipment.
    Sadly any Scottish troops should be indistinguishable from the other Commonwealth troops after Dunkirk. Battledress Blouse and Trousers, Ammunition Boots, and Tin Bowler (or Tam when out of combat).
    On Ebay currently:
    https://www.ebay.com/itm/WWII-Era-48...8AAOSwCONdfR87
    48th Highlanders of Can. instead of 79th, but the badge can be changed out.
    Good Luck!

  7. The Following 2 Users say 'Aye' to KnittedReenactor For This Useful Post:


  8. #6
    Join Date
    16th December 19
    Location
    Austraila
    Posts
    78
    Mentioned
    0 Post(s)
    Tagged
    0 Thread(s)
    Dunkirk impression seem like more interesting.

  9. #7
    Join Date
    18th October 09
    Location
    Orange County California
    Posts
    8,504
    Mentioned
    12 Post(s)
    Tagged
    0 Thread(s)
    Sorry I've not studied the Camerons in WWII, but I have studied every photo I can find of The Black Watch in WWII and as was said above kilts weren't all that common, yet hardly unknown, in the war zone.

    The most common soldiers seen wearing kilts are pipers. Officers would sometimes appear in kilts in parades in the war zone. HQ Guards are seen kilted.

    The book The 51st Highland Division At War by Roderick Grant has the following post-Dunkirk photos of interest:

    Page 77: a Captain of the Cameron Highlanders wearing jumper, kilt, leather sporran in the Western Desert

    Page 78: the Cameron Highlanders on parade in Tunisia, all officers are kilted, without sporrans.

    Page 78: the massed pipes & drums of the Highland Division on parade in Tunisia; pipers and drummers of the Cameron Highlanders are kilted.

    The basic truth is that unless your impression is a piper, officer, or HQ Guard kilts would be pre-Dunkirk.

    I've not seen a photo of such a Guard with the QOCH but here's a HQ Guard of The Black Watch, European Theatre 1944



    Pipers entertaining a recenty-liberated town, France 1944. Hard to tell, but it looks like the piper to right is wearing Cameron Of Erracht while the others might be Gordon?



    Here's a Cameron Highlander in 1945, showing the non-regulation but popular wearing the Battle Dress blouse open with collar and tie



    As far as the nuts&bolts of putting together such an outfit, reproductions of the Battle Dress blouse, TOS, 1937 webbing equipment, boots, and puttees are widely available from such places as What Price Glory. In some cases original items are still available.

    By far the most expensive item will be the kilt. If you're slender enough, original kilts come up on Ebay regularly and inexpensively.

    If you're not slender enough, and not satisfied with the inaccurate Indian/Pakistani reproductions, getting a real Scottish-made MOD spec kilt made is expensive.

    First you must decide on whether your impression is Other Ranks or a senior Sergeant or Officer, for their kilts used different fabric.

    Senior Sergeants and Officers kilts were made from tartan very much like our modern civilian 16oz kilting cloth, available from a number of weavers.

    Other Ranks kilts were made from heavier, fuzzier fabric (akin to a travel rug) which is still being woven by House Of Edgar, in 18oz. Last time I looked they were still offering the OR Cameron Of Erracht 18oz cloth, a dead ringer for the cloth you see on vintage QOCH kilts.

    Then there's the fact that QOCH kilts are box-pleated, and you have to hunt for a kiltmaker who does military box pleats. They look like this



    Also a WWI or WWII British military kilt is going to have a higher "rise" (distance between the buckles at the binding), lack of fringe, the traditional military herringbone grass-green wool tape binding, and the two-prong stamped steel buckles, all well seen on this Seaforth military kilt:



    Here's an overall view of a (Seaforth) military kilt showing the high rise, buckles, binding, etc



    This being the "show us your pics" forum, here I am in my WWII Black Watch piper impression (the other guy is WWI).

    My pipes are the real thing, made under MOD contract in 1945.





    Black Watch piper, Western Desert, WWII

    Last edited by OC Richard; 14th January 20 at 05:11 AM.
    Proud Mountaineer from the Highlands of West Virginia; son of the Revolution and Civil War; first Europeans on the Guyandotte

  10. The Following 5 Users say 'Aye' to OC Richard For This Useful Post:


  11. #8
    Join Date
    24th February 18
    Location
    Alberta Canada
    Posts
    18
    Mentioned
    0 Post(s)
    Tagged
    0 Thread(s)

    Cameron re-enactment

    I'll join in, taking advantage of the "show us your pics" sub-forum as well.

    Congrats to the OP on finding an original Cameron box pleat kilt, and good luck with the re-enactment. As my grandfather served in the Great War with the 43rd Bn CEF, I wanted a Cameron kilt for my first kilt, and lucked into a used ex-military box pleat example locally. As I'm part of a British Militaria group that does several organized shooting events featuring many in representative uniforms, I built up a uniform to represent what my grandfather would have worn during the Great War, anchored around the kilt and a 1910-dated and C-broad arrow-marked 43rd hair sporran. First outing pictured below, absent the Pattern 1908 web gear. As has been mentioned, What Price Glory is a good source for materials, although their tams are huge. Keep us posted. And OC Richard...nice work there, sir. The pipes are Hendersons?


  12. The Following User Says 'Aye' to MenOfTheNorth For This Useful Post:


  13. #9
    Join Date
    18th October 09
    Location
    Orange County California
    Posts
    8,504
    Mentioned
    12 Post(s)
    Tagged
    0 Thread(s)
    The pipes are by Starck, London, who held an MOD contract during WWII, as I understand. They're great-sounding pipes BTW, not surprising as Starck was known for top quality.

    My first Highland re-enacting impression was a WWI Cameron Highlander. It was in the 1970s and I was a very skinny teenager and able to fit into original uniforms. My tunic, my kilt, all my P08 web gear, even my bonnet were originals...as were my WG and SMLE. I don't think I have a single photo of me all kitted out!

    Nowadays P08 webbing is worth a fortune, back in the 1970s it was widely available and not expensive.
    Last edited by OC Richard; 27th March 20 at 01:27 PM.
    Proud Mountaineer from the Highlands of West Virginia; son of the Revolution and Civil War; first Europeans on the Guyandotte

  14. The Following User Says 'Aye' to OC Richard For This Useful Post:


Bookmarks

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •  

» Log in

User Name:

Password:

Not a member yet?
Register Now!
Powered by vBadvanced CMPS v4.2.0