Pleat Depth

[HeathBar]

I'm new here, but I've got a question thats been nagging me for some time.
A while back, I bought some non-clan tartan in a medium weight wool. I have 3yds and it double-width. So I figure I have 6yds to make a kilt. Now I'm a pretty big guy so I figure I'm going to need every bit of it.
My question is, should I go with fewer (10) deep pleats or more (18-20) shallow pleats.
No, I don't have BarbT's book, yet. I found some basic kiltmaking instructions a year or so ago, and just recently dug them out.
Any help or thought would be appreciated.

Thanks
HeathBar

[Barb T]

Hi!

A kilt with 10 deep pleats doesn't look much like a traditional kilt, which isn't necessarily bad. Traditional kilts typically have 20-30 pleats or so.

Realize, though, that, with tartan, you can't simply choose the number of pleats and pleat depth, because the number of pleats and pleat depth are governed by the repeat (the sett) of the tartan (roughly, each pleat takes up one repeat of the sett). If the sett is big, you have fewer repeats to work with and, hence, fewer (but deeper) pleats). If the sett is small, you have more repeats to work with, hence more (but shallower) pleats.

If you have a smallish amount of tartan, you can get more pleats into a kilt by pleating it to the stripe, because each pleat takes up _exactly_ one sett, whereas, in pleating to the sett, each pleat takes up roughly one sett plus and inch or so. If the sett is really small, you can put a double sett into each pleat, but that cuts the number of pleats in half.

If that's confusing, I'll try explaining it again!!

Barb

[HeathBar]

I think I understand what you were saying. I'm not going to try to pleat to the sett. I'm not sure about the stripe, either. I guess I didn't explain enough. As far as swing, hang, and over all appearence, which would be better. Or is it a matter of preference.
I know its not going to be the same as a traditional 8 yarder, but is there a happy median.

HeathBar

[bubba]

Two choices that would suit me, more shallow pleats or box pleat it.

[Barb T]

Hi Heathbar

As far as swing and hang go, it doesn't matter a bit whether you pleat it to the stripe or to the sett. As far as appearance goes, it makes a huge difference, because kilts pleated to the stripe look very different from ones pleated to the sett. And, if you don't do either one, it will look more like a kilted skirt than a kilt, because kilts are always pleated either to the sett or to the stripe.

Barb

[James]

Ignoring pleating to the sett etc, and purely thinking about the number of pleats:-

For a really super smart kilt the full pleating is desirable. However for day to day use I usually wear either the hillwalker with it's limited number of deep pleats or the 'gentleman's' with it's four very deep pleats.

Obviously in both cases the swing is different, but they are comfortable to wear-and feel and look like a kilt to any but the most overly critical eye.

I have by the way worn both the above variants to highland/clan events where they have been admired-and that is by people who take their kilt wearing seriously, and where to wear a tartan just because one liked the colours would be a serious no no, as would a kilt that covered the knees.

So I would suggest that the number of pleats is less important than things like length, and such accoutrements as the skean dhu--in fact whilst having the 'gentleman's' kilt admired-I've had strife for leaving off the skean dhu.

So reverting to the original question, I'd suggest that the choice can be left to you as to the number and depth of pleats.

James

[bubba]

As for leaving out the skean dhu, it's better than facing a concealed weapon charge. Around here to carry a knife it must be a folding knife, no switchblades allowed, and the blade can be no more than 3 inches long. Stage plays and authorized reenactments are the only exceptions they'll make.

[Jimmy Carbomb]

So I would suggest that the number of pleats is less important than things like length, and such accoutrements as the skean dhu--in fact whilst having the 'gentleman's' kilt admired-I've had strife for leaving off the skean dhu.

DANG!!! You hang-out with some REAL hardballers!!! I hope they never see a picture of me!!!

It's always been funny to me about the pleat depth issue. There are just some materials that do well when they're not deep, and others that really need it for a proper drape. I know, I know... there's always the sett and the repeat to take into account, but the depth is so critical in the drape. It's a tough world out there, and one that would only be perfect if all tartans were woven in a universal "kilt-ready" repeat. I know a few kiltmakers that would be MORE than happy to see that happen too! :grin:

[HeathBar]

Thanks to everyone for their input. I have looked over the material once more and decided to pleat to the stripe. I tested a particular stripe and think it will look pretty good.
The only problem now is these two light lines on one side of a dark line. Since the material is doublewidth, I half to cut and put the two ends together. And the only way to get everything to match up is to flip one side upside down, making the slevedge on the top in one half and the bottom on the other. So now I'm looking heming the bottom. My hats off to those skilled artisans who do this everyday.
Wish me luck.

HeathBar

[beerbecue]

Oh no, an asymmetrical tartan!!!???

I went through this with my Hunting Stewart kilt.......

A bit of a pain, but not that bad..... I didn't have to 'flip' it, I had to offset the two pieces, about 1/2 a sett, and hem the bottom, as there was no selvedge left at all after getting them trimmed to match properly.....

I don't think I quite follow, though, about the 'upside down' comment.... Whatever you do, you MUST make sure that the twill lines match when you connect the two pieces... I think they must run like \\\\\\\\\\\ (but that is from memory at the moment) when looking at it right side up (top edge at tope edge in front of you)

If your tartan is symmetrical, there should be no problems, whatsoever, you just rip it, turn it to the correct twill direction, line up the selvedge edge, and go. If you have an asymmetric tartan (there are very few, and I can't recall them, besides H.S. at the moment), you not only have to match the twill, but also the sett - this means not flipping the material at all, but after ripping, sliding it down until the sett matches, then ripping any necessary edges to make the lengths the same......

Take your time, study the sett, and it will all work out......

OK, to follow up, I made a little webpage which describes what I am trying to say here, hopefully, with words and pictures, the meaning comes throught

http://webpages.charter.net/twjesse/asymmetric.htm