To hat bow or Not to hat bow

**Hothir Ethelnor** · 2nd November 09, 09:27 PM

It is mentioned in So You're Going To Wear The Kilt. that it is a legend or old tradition that says the ribbons indicate one's relational status (untied ribbons the heart of a young man free to admire the ladies.) and tied ribbons to indicate a married or engaged man who is bound by love and honour to his chosen mate.

But the ending conclusion is that although it's a fun story and you can subscribe to it if you like, (I do for the fun of it) he just recommends cutting the ribbon off.

And most "traditionalists" (I use the term lightly) insist it should be tied properly.

**Lachlan09** · 12th December 09, 08:58 PM

If you want to get really pernickity (is that how it’s spelt ?), you could say that a glengarry or balmoral may only be seen as representing the descendants of the Hanoverian Crown if the black cockade (ie the silk rosette) is worn on its left side, as is the case with the RRS. Many civvy hats are available without the cockade/rosette and it can be removed from those which have it.

As for bonnet-tails, the balmoral issued to replace the glengarry in Spring 1915 for Scottish infantry regiments was close-fitting like a modern British Army beret, knitted plain dark blue overall (no regimental dicing at all) with black silk-like bow-tie and hanging, ribbon tails and with a red toorie. To the best of my recollection, there was no cockade. In the trenches, it was worn under a khaki cotton cover (without toorie). In late 1915, it was replaced by the voluminous all khaki sewn cloth Tam O’Shanter with khaki wool toorie, with short tails tied in a bow with no hanging portion left over. Again no khaki cockade, though I used to have a Royal Scots officer’s WW1 dated ToS which did have a khaki silk cockade. Presumably an officers’ tradition.

Up till 2006, the dark blue Black Watch balmoral didn’t have either a rosette or tails (see my album). Presumably, the rosette would have looked odd in front of the red hackle with no badge. The red hackle is fixed internally via a little hole in the left side of the bonnet rather than being fixed behind a badge.

**Ozark Ridge Rider** · 10th January 10, 09:12 AM

Originally Posted by Lachlan09

If you want to get really pernickity (is that how it’s spelt ?),

.

From Paul Brian's "Common Errors in English Usage":

The original Scottish dialect form was “pernickety,” but Americans changed it to “persnickety” a century ago. “Pernickety” is generally unknown in the US though it’s still in wide use across the Atlantic.

**beloitpiper** · 10th January 10, 10:34 AM

In my pipe band (and I know MANY other pipe bands to this too), the pipers wear non-diced glengarrys and the drummers wear the diced ones. I don't know why, maybe just to have the drummers stand out, but I think it looks good.

**macwilkin** · 27th January 10, 05:24 AM

Originally Posted by labhran1

It came from the highland regiments and the way drummers were classified in the old dress regulations compared to pipers. Its is long winded to explain and frankly not that interesting but that was the route of the issue.

Just enjoy.

Actually, a number of us would like to hear it. I know I would.

T.

**MacMillan of Rathdown** · 27th January 10, 08:30 AM

Originally Posted by Lachlan09

If you want to get really pernickity (is that how it’s spelt ?), you could say that a glengarry or balmoral may only be seen as representing the descendants of the Hanoverian Crown if the black cockade (ie the silk rosette) is worn on its left side, as is the case with the RRS.

Actually, outside of the military, a black cockade on any hat is usually the mark of a follower, a servant, an employee, or a sign of mourning. Traditionally speaking, civilian cockades should be made up of one's livery colours, or the livery colours of one's chief. And shame on those who do not know their chief's livery...

**macwilkin** · 27th January 10, 10:18 AM

Originally Posted by MacMillan of Rathdown

Actually, outside of the military, a black cockade on any hat is usually the mark of a follower, a servant, an employee, or a sign of mourning. Traditionally speaking, civilian cockades should be made up of one's livery colours, or the livery colours of one's chief. And shame on those who do not know their chief's livery...

Or and azure.

T.