Sgian Dubh sheath slippage

[creagdhubh]

Thanks for the tips! I'll try them. Sheath this this style.

Attachment 10953

That's the same style of sheath I have on my bespoke stag horn handled sgian dubhs from Comrie Crafts. They have never slipped!

[Father Bill]

When I've done wet molding, I've also added a thin sheet of card-stock of the same shape as the blade, then the saran wrap, then done the molding. Thus, when dried, there's a wee bit of slack to allow the blade space to enter.

Another option is to include a piece of thin copper sheeting along the sharp edge. It's then incorporated into the sheath to prevent the leather from being cut, but a metal soft enough to prevent overly dulling the blade.

[Nathan]

Wet-molded leather works very well indeed. My own sgian and sheath (made for me by someone here at Xmarks) stay firmly in place -- though I'm sure the fact that I use garter ties rather than flashes helps with that.

I also typically use garter ties rather than flashes with day wear. but I don't like the whole handle (it's quite heavy) above the ties so I slip part of the handle below the garter tie, thus the pressure of the tie is not directly on the sheath, but rather on the antler handle itself.

[MNlad]

*** wet molding. You could also glue a very thin scrap of leather in the opening at the top of the sheath to take up the slack. However, you would have to be careful each time you resheath the blade so it doesn't catch the edge of the scrap, unless it is big enough to also wrap over the top and down the back of the sheath a bit.

[CMcG]

I've handled Nathan's sgian and the antler is massive. Very nice, sharp Sheffield steel too!

Just wet moulding his current sheath is unlikely to counteract the problem completely. I'd suggest getting a slightly bigger sheath and wet moulded to the knife, so that part of the handle is covered by the leather. That way, when the sgian is pushed further into the hose to counter balance the weight of the handle, some of the sheath could still be under the garter ties.

[Nathan]

I tried wet moulding the current sheath last night and the retention seems to be better but I haven't worn it yet. If it doesn't work, I may take Colin's advice and have a new sheath made.

[MNlad]

I've handled Nathan's sgian and the antler is massive

.

Given that description, I can see where it would be a problem, the depth of the handle is probably leaving the sheath hanging somewhat loose under the hose. Yes, a new sheath that covers the lower part of the stag handle is probably the ultimate answer.

While a belt sheath, this gives you an idea of how a deeper sheath can lock in the knife. Given the usual textured surface of an antler, it should work great.

[unixken]

The word "massive" has been used in this thread to describe the handle, and it sounds like the design may be an overall "top heavy" one, for use as a sgian dubh. (If not top-heavy by weight, then at least dimensionally/proportionally.)

If the handle, inserted into the top of the hose, is stretching the circumference of the hose and garter enough that they don't adequately compress the sheath against the leg (and the sheath subsequently slips down to the ankle), perhaps it's time to consider a different sgian dubh, of a more practical size or proportion, and find a different way to wear/carry the larger-handled knife. Likewise, if the current sheath is so paper thin that the hose doesn't even realize it's there, that too can cause a problem.

The hose and garter/flashes should always secure the sheath against movement, with or without the blade inserted. Withdrawing the blade should never bring the sheath out with it, and reinserting the blade should never cause the sheath to slip down in the hose.

Likewise, the sheath alone should support the knife, without relying on applied tension from the hose and/or garter. If the sheathed blade is dependent upon the hose and/or garter to secure the blade, you have problems of fit such as you're now facing when the blade is inserted (the knife isn't secure in the sheath, and the sheath isn't secure against the leg). The sheath will fall down in the hose because it's not secured to the leg.

If you hold the sheath by the tip end, upside down, does the knife slip out under gravity alone? If so, your sheath isn't supporting the knife. And if your sheath is slipping down low in your hose, with or without the blade, then the hose and garter aren't supporting the sheath. Each issue must be addressed.

In the end, you should be able to trot a fair distance without the knife and/or sheath falling out or slipping down your leg.

Given the defensive weapon origins of the sgian dubh:
You wouldn't find it helpful for the knife to fall out every time you ran...
It wouldn't be very useful if upon drawing to defend your life, the knife was still in it's sheath...
When the defensive event had concluded, eyes (and adrenaline) would be elevated, scanning for additional threats. Not down, looking for your sheath at the bottom of your hose.

[MNlad]

Given the defensive weapon origins of the sgian dubh:
You wouldn't find it helpful for the knife to fall out every time you ran...
It wouldn't be very useful if upon drawing to defend your life, the knife was still in it's sheath.

Quite true. I was just more concerned with protecting Nathan's hide from his own blade, rather than those of others. I think most wear a sgian today as a decorative accompaniment to the kilt first, as a handy multi-purpose knife second, and as a last-ditch defense weapon last. Still, no matter how you cut it , it sounds like it's quite an awkward load to be secured in your sock.

[Dale Seago]

Given the defensive weapon origins of the sgian dubh. . .

[thread hijack] My understanding of the origin is that the origin was a gamekeeper's knife carried in the hose, not -- as many think -- that it was a "devolution" of the sgian achlais, which was indeed a weapon. [/thread hijack]