THCD, Not THCD

[ThistleDown]

I wonder, Nathan, if the Barbour is traditional. It certainly is widely worn in the Highlands, but I'm not sure it has yet reached the stage where it can be called traditional civilian Highland dress. It might fall into the same class as the fore-and-aft: acceptable when worn with Highland dress, but not traditionally worn with Highland dress.

[Liam]

I agree with Tobus. A case in point being that I think a Barbour jacket is now considered traditional country wear and, given the similar demographic of those who wear kilts and those who pursue country recreation in the UK, it has de facto become traditional kilt wear given the appropriate weather. My undertanding is that it has all but displaced the Inverness cape among traditional civilian kilt wearers.

We know that the Barbour jacket was invented by Barbour.

Nathan... I'm glad you agree that what becomes Traditional Highland attire can actually originate outside of the Highlands.
Cheers...

[Nathan]

Nathan... I'm glad you agree that what becomes Traditional Highland attire can actually originate outside of the Highlands.
Cheers...

Indeed it can, Liam. Take for example the eagle feather used to symbolize rank with Traditional Highland Civilian Dress. There is no evidence of this existing prior to contact with the North American aboriginals. That said, something only becomes Traditional Highland Civilian Dress when Highland Civilians adopt it. I don't know why this concept bothers you or why you've chosen to raise it continually with me. I wasn't the first on this forum to articulate it nor is it a controversial claim. It is a simple descriptive fact. If something is really popular to wear with a kilt in, say, South Africa but is rarely seen or perhaps maligned as a poor choice in the Highlands of Scotland, what claim would it have to be traditional Highland civilian dress? I'm merely repeating the notion that in order for something to be considered the traditional dress of a people it has to be adopted and accepted by that people.

I'm a diaspora Highland Scot and I am very connected to the culture of my home island of Cape Breton. Notwithstanding the fact that the dominant culture on the Island is diaspora Highland Gaels, if we do something that diverges from Scotland, it becomes our traditional culture, not theirs.

N

[Liam]

Indeed it can, Liam. Take for example the eagle feather used to symbolize rank with Traditional Highland Civilian Dress. There is no evidence of this existing prior to contact with the North American aboriginals. That said, something only becomes Traditional Highland Civilian Dress when Highland Civilians adopt it. I don't know why this concept bothers you or why you've chosen to raise it continually with me. I wasn't the first on this forum to articulate it nor is it a controversial claim. It is a simple descriptive fact. If something is really popular to wear with a kilt in, say, South Africa but is rarely seen or perhaps maligned as a poor choice in the Highlands of Scotland, what claim would it have to be traditional Highland civilian dress? I'm merely repeating the notion that in order for something to be considered the traditional dress of a people it has to be adopted and accepted by that people.

I'm a diaspora Highland Scot and I am very connected to the culture of my home island of Cape Breton. Notwithstanding the fact that the dominant culture on the Island is diaspora Highland Gaels, if we do something that diverges from Scotland, it becomes our traditional culture, not theirs.

N

This will continue to be a subject, that I doubt we will come to mutual agreement. Highland dress, like Western dress is practiced in many parts of the world. Civilian Highland dress whether traditional or historical was exported to the world with the exportation of the Highlanders along with other aspects of their culture. Highland traditions are practiced all over the world where ever the diaspora as you like to use find themselves. My position is that these traditions belong to the disporia and current Highlanders collectively not just to the current residents of the Scottish Highlands. THCD is a concept only at Xmarks, practiced by Xmarkers, and not a tradition of those who wear Highland dress in the Highlands of Scotland, or indeed anywhere else in the world, unless they are Xmarkers.

[Jock Scot]

This will continue to be a subject, that I doubt we will come to mutual agreement. Highland dress, like Western dress is practiced in many parts of the world. Civilian Highland dress whether traditional or historical was exported to the world with the exportation of the Highlanders along with other aspects of their culture. Highland traditions are practiced all over the world where ever the diaspora as you like to use find themselves. My position is that these traditions belong to the disporia and current Highlanders collectively not just to the current residents of the Scottish Highlands. THCD is a concept only at Xmarks, practiced by Xmarkers, and not a tradition of those who wear Highland dress in the Highlands of Scotland, or indeed anywhere else in the world, unless they are Xmarkers.

I really do not want to get involved in this discussion other than to say that THCD is indeed an xmarks definition and was introduced here to make it clear that traditional kilt attire was under discussion , not Historical, not theatrical and not modern kilt styles. There was a time here on xmarks that rather unpleasant confusion occurred from time to time and the introduction of THCD along with the other clear labelling on xmarks solved many unpleasant discussions. Again to be perfectly clear, very few in Scotland have ever heard of THCD, why should they? The kilt is after all a Scottish garment connected to Scotland(at least for the last three hundred years or so anyway)in most people's minds anyway, that rightly or wrongly, some in the rest of the modern civilian world has decided to take an interest in, in relatively recent times. Nevertheless THCD does serve a useful purpose here on xmarks.

[Liam]

I really do not want to get involved in this discussion other than to say that THCD is indeed an xmarks definition and was introduced here to make it clear that traditional kilt attire was under discussion , not Historical, not theatrical and not modern kilt styles. There was a time here on xmarks that rather unpleasant confusion occurred from time to time and the introduction of THCD along with the other clear labelling on xmarks solved many unpleasant discussions. Again to be perfectly clear, very few in Scotland have ever heard of THCD, why should they? The kilt is after all a Scottish garment connected to Scotland(at least for the last three hundred years or so anyway)in most people's minds anyway, that rightly or wrongly, some in the rest of the modern civilian world has decided to take an interest in, in relatively recent times. Nevertheless THCD does serve a useful purpose here on xmarks.

Jock...I don't wish to continue this either and I agree that that the term THCD is useful in exactly the way you describe, and the other issues such as how it came to be, who may have rights to wear it, only serve to cause friction.


Cheers