Scottish or Welsh?

[Phillips]

My surname is Phillips. And while using ancestry.com I traced the Phillips line back to Cumberland county NC, where he was born in 1729. There is also a petition I found asking a city in Scotland for a minister, and 2 Phillips signed it. According to Cumberland county's website, 1729 is when they were founded and settled by Highland scots of various clans including the MacDonalds. McPhillips is a sept of this clan but only a few Phillips can claim this line. Most are welsh.

Welsh immigrants immigrated to the Cape Fear valley of NC (areas around Cumberland county) from Pennsylvania during 18th century as well. I can. Or trace my line any further than this right now. So I am seeking other opninions on whether this ancestor is more likely to be Scottish or welsh?

[tripleblessed]

My Phillips line migrated out of North Carolina into Wilkes County, Georgia, before the Revolution. Mark Phillips served
as a colonel of dragoons. His son Royal Budd served as a colonel of dragoons in 1812 and the Seminole campaigns.
The Phillips family provided the land for Phillips Mill Baptist Church, founded 1785. This line appears to be Welsh in origin,
and moved to Georgia along with Moseley and Wilkes families with whom they had intermarried. They came from an area NE of Fayetteville, so somewhere between possibly and probably connected.

Now that that's cleared up, choose a tartan and enjoy. I've always liked the attitude of the clan Ross Society: they invite everyone to be part of their society, suggesting they'll help with the genealogy, and if it turns out you belong somewhere else, then at least you had fun with them while looking.

[LKM]

1729 is before most census records that would tell you where someone was born. My family was also in NC around the time, although my family went to Pasquotank county from Elizabeth City in the Jamestown area. The best bet would be to see if you can find an ancestor on a ship list as see if there is any more information. I often use the site below when looking for early colonists.

http://www.packrat-pro.com/ships/shiplist.htm

Many of the people that moved to the Carolina colony in the early 18th century because of religious pressures in the other colonies. Massachusetts Bay was Puritan and Pilgrim while Jamestown was Church of England. Many Welsh colonists were non-conformists, what we would call non-denominational Christians today. There were also many Quaker families from Scotland that went to the Carolinas in those days. Either way, non-conformist and Quaker records from the time are few and far between.

[davidlpope]

The only way to know whether you are of Scottish descent is to do the hard genealogical work to trace your family back to its origin. Honest uncertainty of one's origins is better than a theory not supported by documentation.

That doesn't prevent you from wearing tartan or kilt, however. There are several general tartans for use by anyone, many which are quite beautiful. If you have roots here in North Carolina then I suggest the Carolina tartan.

[Tarheel]

There were also many Quaker families from Scotland that went to the Carolinas in those days. Either way, non-conformist and Quaker records from the time are few and far between.

There were a few churches / Meeting houses (like my own family and community) that were constant from the 1720's until now and kept records updated. There was then, and suggested that families today, keep their own records to supplement the church files. It is worth checking into if an ancestor married into the Quaker church and converted (even if for social standing and not the religious tenets).

[tripleblessed]

My surname is Phillips. And while using ancestry.com I traced the Phillips line back to Cumberland county NC, where he was born in 1729. There is also a petition I found asking a city in Scotland for a minister, and 2 Phillips signed it. According to Cumberland county's website, 1729 is when they were founded and settled by Highland scots of various clans including the MacDonalds. McPhillips is a sept of this clan but only a few Phillips can claim this line. Most are welsh.

Welsh immigrants immigrated to the Cape Fear valley of NC (areas around Cumberland county) from Pennsylvania during 18th century as well. I can. Or trace my line any further than this right now. So I am seeking other opninions on whether this ancestor is more likely to be Scottish or welsh?

Further reading of the Cumberland website reveals my suspicions were correct, that if born that early, it was still
Bladen County. The website says the community that became Cumberland County (Campbellton, later renamed Fayetteville) was being populated as early as stated above, but not actually formed as a county of its own until 1754
(see next paragraph of site's text). Named for the Duke of Cumberland, best known for the '45. The languaging of the website is ambiguous. Anyone born there in 1729 was living in Bladen County; as that's where my Morrison, Gillis, and Hughes lines settled, I was pretty sure that was the case. Phillips families came into NC from Wales and Scotland directly, from Virginia and Pennsylvania seeking fresh farmland. The Pennsylvania folk were often Quakers, some of whom later moved on from Orange County, NC to found the town of Wrightsborough in what was then Wilkes County. Depending on where in Bladen they settled, the records might be in Bladen, Robeson, Cumberland, or some other formed from Bladen. Can be tricky finding original records, but as David said above, the only sure way is to ferret out the original records yourself. Ancestry.com, like almost all other sites, is plagued by the fact that incorrect info once entered is almost impossible to root out. Many got bored, disappeared, and can't be contacted to get them to correct their pages.

Good luck, and have fun sorting it out. I'd like to be more helpful, but not all of my files are currently accessible, and what
I can access can't confirm a connection.

[Phillips]

Thank you for the help. I was aware of Cumberland being once laden county. Unfortunately the only way to confirm or deny my families origins is to find the records myself. One day I will find myself in those counties with time to search the records. Till then a cloud of doubt will hang over that family line.

[Stoff]

It might be worth a phone call to the county seat. My of North Carolina's counties have a county genealogical library/record center. If so they just might be able to help. I know that my Dad did this when he was researching our family's history about 10 years ago. He was operating from Richlands in Onslow County and did much of his research over the phone and on the internet. You might also check with your local LDS church, they are one of the leading genealogical record centers in the USA. Also check with your local genealogical society.

Unfortunately he passed away in 2008 or I would put you in touch with him. He was always eager to help others trying to research their family history.

Good luck with your search.

Christoph, also a native of NC with a long family history.

[Damion]

People were clannish back then so tended to marry within their own religion. Scots would be Catholic, Presbyterian or Episcopalian. Anglican patriots became Episcopalians I believe after the revolution, but prior to that Episcopalians should point more to Scottish ancestry. So if you can find out what church these people belonged to, it would be a good indicator if they were Scots or Welsh. Another indicator is who they married. Scots would more likely marry other Scots and the same for Welsh. There may also be clues with names so check the origin of first names of your ancestors and their families to see if there are any telltale ethnic names.

[Phillips]

People were clannish back then so tended to marry within their own religion. Scots would be Catholic, Presbyterian or Episcopalian. Anglican patriots became Episcopalians I believe after the revolution, but prior to that Episcopalians should point more to Scottish ancestry. So if you can find out what church these people belonged to, it would be a good indicator if they were Scots or Welsh. Another indicator is who they married. Scots would more likely marry other Scots and the same for Welsh. There may also be clues with names so check the origin of first names of your ancestors and their families to see if there are any telltale ethnic names.

I just read back over the settlements petition for a minister and they are writing to the synod of Argyll. Which I believe is Presbyterian.