Identity in the Scottish Diaspora

[ThistleDown]

In 2011 20.6 percent of the Canadian population was foreign-born, the highest percentage in the G8 countries. Almost 6,800,000 representing 200 ethnic origins. Of the non-G8 countries, Canada was second only to Australia in the number of foreign-born nationals.

In 2011 4,715,000 (over 13 percent) reported ethnic Scottish origin, 6,510,000 reported English origin (including roughly 1,000,000 thought to be Scottish or Scottish and English), 5,100,000 reported French, and 10,600,000 reported Canadian.

In 2014 Scotland's population was 5,328,000 of whom 76,000 reported Poland as their country of origin, 26,000 reported India, 19,000 reported Germany, 18,000 reported Pakistan, and 20,000 reported Eire.

[Father Bill]

Which is why, with so many ethnic interests, heritages, cultures, and aching hearts, so many Canadians hyphenate ourselves.

[davidlpope]

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Wow, I hadn't appreciated exactly what the population of Scotland is. I knew that in terms of geography it was about the size of South Carolina, but I'm struck by the fact that the population of North Carolina is almost twice that of Scotland.

After looking more closely at some population data, I'm also surprised that the combined populations of Scotland, Wales, and Northern Ireland are about the same as that of North Carolina alone.

[Liam]

Part of the fascination of recearching one's ancestry for those who have moved from their ancestral home is to know what one's roots are. If you or your ancestors have never ventured from where you were yourself were born, then you can simply walk to your Kirk yard and look at tomb stones. 😉
It is not surprising that those who have never left their ancestral homes could understand regardless of how many times those of us whose ancestors have, try. That doesn't make either side right or wrong, but is a point where we should accept and move on.

[ThistleDown]

'I'm not sure what Humza Yousaf calls himself but his political allegiance would suggest to me that he sees himself as a Scot with a Kenyan mother and Pakistani father. I've never heard anyone called an "Asian-Scot" or a "Pakistani-Scot" but I suppose a newspaper might use such a term for brevity.'

Humza does not have dual citizenship. He is a Scot with Pakistani heritage. He does not call himself a Pakistani-Scot or a Scottish-Pakistani. I asked, he answered.

[Terry Searl]

In 2011 20.6 percent of the Canadian population was foreign-born, the highest percentage in the G8 countries. Almost 6,800,000 representing 200 ethnic origins. Of the non-G8 countries, Canada was second only to Australia in the number of foreign-born nationals.

In 2011 4,715,000 (over 13 percent) reported ethnic Scottish origin, 6,510,000 reported English origin (including roughly 1,000,000 thought to be Scottish or Scottish and English), 5,100,000 reported French, and 10,600,000 reported Canadian.

In 2014 Scotland's population was 5,328,000 of whom 76,000 reported Poland as their country of origin, 26,000 reported India, 19,000 reported Germany, 18,000 reported Pakistan, and 20,000 reported Eire.

I was born in Canada in 1948 and consider myself Canadian. My Maternal Grand father was Dublin born and came to Canada by himself as a lad of 12, just before the turn of the century. My great grand father on the paternal side was also Irish born and came to Canada, during the famines. Most of the immigrants prior to my birthing were from Europe where WWII had wrecked such havoc, but since then we have had a great number of Asian immigrants. Diversity is a most wonderful thing. Culture includes dress, foods, celebrations and ethnic ties to the country from whence our forebears have come. I don't agree with with including and hyphenating my forebears country but I do appreciate the beautiful things they all brought to Canada......... except intolerance....and I'll leave it at that

[ThistleDown]

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Wow, I hadn't appreciated exactly what the population of Scotland is. I knew that in terms of geography it was about the size of South Carolina, but I'm struck by the fact that the population of North Carolina is almost twice that of Scotland.

After looking more closely at some population data, I'm also surprised that the combined populations of Scotland, Wales, and Northern Ireland are about the same as that of North Carolina alone.

It is important to note in these census reports that the number of people in Canada who report Scottish ethnic origin exceeds the entire population of Scotland who report Scottish origin.

So, the issue here is not the nationality of each of us because that is a matter of citizenship. The questions are: If you wear a cowboy hat does that make you a Texan? If you wear a shemagh does that make you a Palestinian? If you like 'warrior' culture does that make you an 19C Cossack or a 20C Zulu or an 18C Scottish Highlander? If you like Northern California culture are you a Californian? If you like the outback does that make you Australian? If you like quaint villages with thatched roofs does that make you English?

[Reiver]

I've been thinking about the 'insecurity' comment related to outwiths wearing traditional garb.

I think Jock has a point but I don't think the proper target was struck.

I remember one of his past comments that his Son in law (I believe) was asked by his daughter why he didn't were a kilt more often and he responded "I don't want to look like a tourist"....that's his insecurity not ours.

It seems to me this kerfuffle is due to Scots insecurity not the outwiths.

As emulation is a form of praise why would Scots take offense unless they had some other issue that underlies?

Nickle and dime psychology certainly but approach it from a different angle and you may find some truth.

[neloon]

I've been thinking about the 'insecurity' comment related to outwiths wearing traditional garb.

I think Jock has a point but I don't think the proper target was struck.

I remember one of his past comments that his Son in law (I believe) was asked by his daughter why he didn't were a kilt more often and he responded "I don't want to look like a tourist"....that's his insecurity not ours.

It seems to me this kerfuffle is due to Scots insecurity not the outwiths.

As emulation is a form of praise why would Scots take offense unless they had some other issue that underlies?

Nickle and dime psychology certainly but approach it from a different angle and you may find some truth.

(I don't think it was Jock's son in law but I believe he may be away from home just now.)
Here is what he actually said
"Is it insecurity that causes some of those from outwith these shores to delve so earnestly into their past? Again, is it insecurity that these distant connections to past times, long gone now, that so much is made of them? I think probably so.I find it strange that the Canadians and Americans that I have met are immensely proud of their country, but they above all other nations have this need to cling to the past. The same goes for other nationalities that I have met, there is still this need, but markedly less so and they too are proud of their respective countries and quite right too, but this rather desperate(sorry) clinging to the past is baffling to most over here."
So the insecurity mentioned was about genealogy - not kilt-wearing.
We are all scuppered by rule #5 here which means that many potentially helpful comments cannot be made. C'est la vie

Alan

[neloon]

Perhaps I could point out that, philosophically, Scots' view of nationality is very much that it is a civic rather than an ethnic matter. This may be distantly related to the philosophy, going right back to Robert the Bruce, that the monarch is not "King of Scotland" but "King of the Scots" e.g. as in "Mary, Queen of Scots".

Alan