The Ghillie Shirt

[Taskr]

Are you honestly saying this gentleman in the photo looks like he's wearing a costume?

(removed the pic for sake of page space)

I think he looks excellent, very smart looking. A Ghillie Shirt, a very smart-looking shirt, a great modern contribution to kilt wearing.

Source: Scotweb

Patrick, you are finding your way of style in kilt wearing. Good on you. There might be three aspects to consider.

1. To some people - that's some - (easy on me rabble, just a comment follows) the kilt and anything about it is a costume. That it has 'always' been around and is actually making a bit of a come-back seems irrelevant to those folks. The kilt in its modern form has endured far longer than some other long-gone items of wardrobe and fashion (historic re-enact set aside) but it can still get looked at askance in many settings.
2. Some kilt wearers (same caveat as above, rabble) get a bit twitchy about anything than appears costume-ish because of the influence of the above perception. In doing so they seek to be informative on what might be romanticizing, traditional and modern so that we can be comfortable in our chosen style.
3. There can be historical inaccuracies, accuracies, half-truths, factual data influencing personal style and personal flair. Each have their own say for self, and interpret as they will. Even "costume" is interpreted depending on the definition chosen. To say anything is "wrong" might be a bit harsh - but there are those who care enough provide a bit of guidance to help us achieve an aire of authenticity with our chosen style. Not that I follow to the letter; but I read, absorb, consider. We can't change others' opinions, but we can accept theirs for what they are. Picking the ones that can really be helpful is the tricky part.

[PatrickHughes123]

Patrick, you are finding your way of style in kilt wearing. Good on you. There might be three aspects to consider.

1. To some people - that's some - (easy on me rabble, just a comment follows) the kilt and anything about it is a costume. That it has 'always' been around and is actually making a bit of a come-back seems irrelevant to those folks. The kilt in its modern form has endured far longer than some other long-gone items of wardrobe and fashion (historic re-enact set aside) but it can still get looked at askance in many settings.
2. Some kilt wearers (same caveat as above, rabble) get a bit twitchy about anything than appears costume-ish because of the influence of the above perception. In doing so they seek to be informative on what might be romanticizing, traditional and modern so that we can be comfortable in our chosen style.
3. There can be historical inaccuracies, accuracies, half-truths, factual data influencing personal style and personal flair. Each have their own say for self, and interpret as they will. Even "costume" is interpreted depending on the definition chosen. To say anything is "wrong" might be a bit harsh - but there are those who care enough provide a bit of guidance to help us achieve an aire of authenticity with our chosen style. Not that I follow to the letter; but I read, absorb, consider. We can't change others' opinions, but we can accept theirs for what they are. Picking the ones that can really be helpful is the tricky part.

Yes, well, I have taken some of the rabble's advice on this forum. For example, I have taken a lot of Jock Scott's advice which you'll see if you go back earlier in the forum. I don't know if Jock has seen it though.

[Macman]

Ghillie shirts, like ghillie brogues, have been around for a long time now. I'm in my early 60's, and they've been around for as long as I can remember. Thousands of people the world over, including in Scotland, wear both. You can buy them at the most traditional highland wear suppliers. Go to any highland games and you'll see lots of them, even in Scotland. I can see why many people see them as traditional highland wear, even if most traditionalists do not.

[Taskr]

Yes, well, I have taken some of the rabble's advice on this forum. For example, I have taken a lot of Jock Scott's advice which you'll see if you go back earlier in the forum. I don't know if Jock has seen it though.

It wasn't a critique, merely some comments. Defending opinions (as opposed to facts) is akin to nailing aspic to a tree - lots of effort for little result.

[Tobus]

I just think it is unfair and harsh to call it a costume piece. It's a type of shirt, regardless of origins just like the grandfather shirt, a plain white shirt or a wing collar shirt. This is just how I see it, I think its place in kilt wearing is underappreciated. I mean, to be honest, why does it matter when it came around? Some doublets and kilt jackets only came around recently, so why does it matter? They're considered genuine.

To be honest, we're into semantics here. The word "costume" has several meanings and connotations. The reason it gets used with the ghillie shirt is because that style is masquerading as a historical design, when it is not. The marketing around this shirt borders on unethical, judging by the number of people who have been conned into buying them whilst thinking they were traditional and correct (I fell for that marketing many years ago as well).

Many people consider it little more than a romanticised fakery, an insulting and ridiculous parody of traditional Highland garb, and suitable only for a costume that one would see on the set of Brigadoon, along with all the other curious failures at accurately representing Highland dress which are seen in such productions. Not to mention the similarity to the pirate shirt as discussed previously. Surely you can understand that anything which reminds people of a pirate is going to immediately come off as a costume.

Obviously, not everyone sees it that way, but it appears that the more traditional-minded do. By all means, wear it if you like it, but know that the more conservative types see it as tat, in the same vein as "see you Jimmy" hats. You may consider it unfair and harsh, and I don't disagree on it being harsh. But it's a very real perception.

Are you honestly saying this gentleman in the photo looks like he's wearing a costume?



I think he looks excellent, very smart looking. A Ghillie Shirt, a very smart-looking shirt, a great modern contribution to kilt wearing.

Since you did ask, yes, he looks to me like he's wearing a costume. Like he just needs a baldric and sword, a tri-corner hat, and a parrot.

[Tobus]

Ghillie shirts, like ghillie brogues, have been around for a long time now. I'm in my early 60's, and they've been around for as long as I can remember. Thousands of people the world over, including in Scotland, wear both. You can buy them at the most traditional highland wear suppliers. Go to any highland games and you'll see lots of them, even in Scotland. I can see why many people see them as traditional highland wear, even if most traditionalists do not.

If you're in your 60s now, I would presume you were born somewhere in the early 1950s, right? I had previously requested that people share any sort of photographic evidence they may have that would show the earliest appearance of the ghillie/Jacobite shirt. I may be wrong, but I don't recall seeing anything that went back that far. It seems like the 1960s-1970s may have been when this style appeared, or at least that seems to be the consensus. If you remember it into the 1950s, that may be revealing.

Just for the sake of context, let's remember what other sorts of imagery was in the public mind back in the 1950s. Romanticised costumes were the norm when portraying the past. After all, this is what people thought cowboys dressed like: Notice any similarity between this and the ghillie shirt?



One might start to theorise that the ghillie shirt was just a Scottish themed variation of a typical costume shirt from that era.

[Macman]

Tobus, my first recollection would be in the 70's. I'm not sure when they first came out. Of course, I have my romanticized versions of cowboys too! I'm just saying that, after all these years, ghillie shirts have now squeezed their way into what I would call "accepted" highland wear, even it they're not traditional highland wear. Not accepted by all, though!

[CollinMacD]

Tobus, my first recollection would be in the 70's. I'm not sure when they first came out. Of course, I have my romanticized versions of cowboys too! I'm just saying that, after all these years, ghillie shirts have now squeezed their way into what I would call "accepted" highland wear, even it they're not traditional highland wear. Not accepted by all, though!

I posted much earlier of the popular "Ponderosa Shirt of the sixties, also referred to as the HIPPIE Shirt.



Little Joe work a shirt similar to the Ghillie shirt. Several cowboys, including Nick Adams of the Series Johnny Yuma the Rebel wore one, and even Steve McQueen work one. Typical Costume shirt of the fifties and sixties, not just for Pirates anymore.....;;





Does this look familiar, markets and Laced up Range Shirt




Patrick all we are saying the Ghillie shirt is not a Scottish traditional shirt, more Wild West or Pirate than Scottish, and yes more of a costume look.

[Taffy Jack]

Just for the sake of context, let's remember what other sorts of imagery was in the public mind back in the 1950s. Romanticised costumes were the norm when portraying the past. After all, this is what people thought cowboys dressed like: Notice any similarity between this and the ghillie shirt?



One might start to theorise that the ghillie shirt was just a Scottish themed variation of a typical costume shirt from that era.

I don't think people really thought that's what "cowboys" looked like. The LR was a masked superhero, riding in to save the day with his loyal sidekick. Pretty sure even kids understood the difference between the Lone Ranger, other movie & TV cowboys, and working cowboys.

Except for cavalry soldiers -- especially air cav. Those guys are notoriously hard to train. ;)

[Taffy Jack]

Not sure how to completely delete this; was a repeat of previous post.

Please disregard. Thx.