Tweed Colour Suggestions.........

[McMurdo]

Would you get the same kind of effect if you got a jacket & waistcoat made in the Northumberland / Falkirk / Shepherd tartan?

I'd toyed with the idea as an exception to the "no mixing of tartans" guideline ... especially since one branch of my family is from Northumberland.

Like this?

[Baeau]

Like this?

Sometimes, you remind me of the Great Oz. Reach into the wardrobe &........something appears. It's much appreciated to see your various jackets, with a dark tertan kilt.

[OC Richard]

I'd toyed with the idea as an exception to the "no mixing of tartans" guideline

Mixing tartans was standard in the 18th century



but had become fairly rare in the 19th century



and is still common in the army

[Allan Thomson]

Mixing tartans was standard in the 18th century

Just recalling one thing I spotted when I looked at a lot of 18thC images of 'highland dress' is that in so many paintings the waistcoats are often longer than the Jackets and so overlap at the bottom edge.

You can see it with the image of the child.

I hypothesised that it may have originated with the cutting down of skirts on the jackets for better wear with the kilt or belted plaid, but that the waistcoat was shorter already and so was not adjusted.

However with the jacket being made in tartan it makes it seem less likely it was a cut down 'Justacorps' and was more likely made with short skirts in origin.

Was it possible that there was a highland fashion in the 18thC for longer waistcoats than coats, or does this practice have origins elsewhere, or is it a case of artistic error (from memory it's observable in a lot of the 18thC portraits)?

I guess the mixing of garnments from separate outfits may have had a part to play as well?

[kingandrew]

Allan,

I think you will find that 18th-Century British style tended toward long waistcoats, even when worn with "pants" (which were likely to be knee breeches). So it may have just been the current trend, rather than something specific to kilt-wearing.

Perhaps another member will have more insight and some kind of documentation.

Oh, and on the tweed color question that started the thread, I have a new development. I recently put down a deposit on a jacket (from Hong Kong's one Highland tailor: Yuen Tailors). The shop had a massive selection of tweeds (unlike my Beijing tailors). Although I have advocated for the assertive checks (and still favor them), I ended up going with an earthy green tweed with a subtle red and blue overcheck. It is a beautiful pattern and will go great with my kilt, but is less punchy than I had originally intended. However, it was the favorite choice of my wife, so that was an important consideration. It is a lighter-weight tweed, since the climate in South China offers few opportunities for wearing the heavy "thornproof" variety.

Andrew

[OC Richard]

I hadn't noticed the long waistcoat thing.

A quick look showed this, which appears to have a rather short waistcoat for that time period (and a kilt box-pleated all around).

[Allan Thomson]

I hadn't noticed the long waistcoat thing.

A quick look showed this, which appears to have a rather short waistcoat for that time period (and a kilt box-pleated all around).

I had a copy of the Christie's catelogue re an auction of jacobite memorabilia. Sadly I don't have access to it now. There was a number of portraits made in the 18thC including the image of the boy (I recall that the image you have provided is cropped and on the left hand side of the image there is a boy in trews with some golf clubs.

I'm sure (from recollection) that a large number of the portraits listed included the longer waistcoat in comparison to the coat. I also think a number of the McIan portraits (although romanticised and 19th C presumablyin some cases inspired by earlier examples?) also show this phenomenon.

I'm aware as another poster said waistcoats tended to be longer in the past even with trews or breeks but they were generally shorter than the coat. However as I've said a large number of contemporary 18thC illustrations appear to show the longer waistcoat in comparison to phenomenon when worn with a kilt.

Also observable is that whilst shorter than other jackets of the period how much longer kilt jackets and waistcoats were in comparison to what we wear now. The sporran cutout is a relativelt 'recent' (19thC?) phenomenon.

[Allan Thomson]

Been looking online for other examples and it has been challenging, but there is a portrait of Lord George Murray which also appears to show the longer waistcoat in comparison to the jacket. Also the boy on the other side of the portrait also has a longer waistcoat.

Quiet a few modern reenactors dress in a similar fashion, and McIan illustrated it, soI guess I am not the only one who spotted the trend?...

[Baeau]

Well, my quest has ended, About 15 minutes ago, I won the Ebay auction. About £55, less shipping. Best part, the dosh goes to a non-profit.
s-l1600.jpgs-l1601.jpgs-l1603.jpgs-l1602.jpg

[gsmacleod]

Well, my quest has ended, About 15 minutes ago, I won the Ebay auction. About £55, less shipping. Best part, the dosh goes to a non-profit.

Very nice! That looks fantastic - plus, I'm a sucker for argyll cuffs!

Shane