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  1. #41
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    Looking forward to seeing it when you get it. Very exciting.

  2. #42
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    18th October 09
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    Quote Originally Posted by RichardtheLarge View Post
    Thank you for your input, Richard—what is your opinion on the “right neckwear” for highland formal, then? If the jabot and cuffs seem too brigadoonish and dated, would one be better off in a white bow tie? Or should one stick to black, confident in his knowledge that in a highland sense the black tie is an equivalent substitute?
    I'll leave it to others to state opinions about what is correct or incorrect. I like to look at what was done over the years, to get a sense of the evolution of the tradition. When I look at things I try to do so from the standpoint of an informed eye.

    The Montrose, apparently introduced in the immediate post-WWI period, was designed to be worn with lace jabot and dirkless narrow dedicated waistbelt. (It's always depicted that way in the 1920s and 1930s.)

    One sees Prince Charlie coatees, then nearly as new (apparently introduced around 1910) sometimes worn with lace jabots in the 1920s and 1930s.

    I do wonder where the idea for the lace jabot came from; it strikes be as being an attempt to get a quasi-18th century look, and thus anachronistic when worn with 19th century jacket styles like the coatee and shell jacket (which is what the Montrose essentially is).

    Which brings up the question of why civilian Highland dress, which made do with two styles (doublet and Argyll) throughout the Victorian period, in the early 20th century suddenly needed to have two 19th century military styles (coatee and shell) resurrected and transformed into new civilian Highland styles. The pairing of these military jackets with lace is doubly odd.

    About my Brigadoon reference, it opened in 1947 and the costumes are a perfect record of the public concepts about ancient Highland Dress at that time. But in fact the Brigadoon outfits are a blend of 18th and 19th century styles and much of it looks like it's right out of the pirate films that were so popular then, plenty of pirate shirts but little lace.

    The bottom line is that lacy Highland Dress is a thing of the Great Wars period, more or less, and has steadily declined in popularity as the end of the 20th century approached.

    How the Sheriffmuir fits into all this is something I'd like to know; if I had to guess it would be that the Sheriffmuir was a product of the post-WWII period.
    Last edited by OC Richard; 4th February 20 at 06:25 AM.
    Proud Mountaineer from the Highlands of West Virginia; son of the Revolution and Civil War; first Europeans on the Guyandotte

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  4. #43
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    Quote Originally Posted by Dr Bee View Post
    Is that such a bad thing, though?
    Yes "dated" can be pejorative, "old-fashioned" neutral. When I see a car from the 1920s driving down the road it's dated and old-fashioned and really cool.

    In fashion "dated" means something that was mainstream style but is no longer, and I think I'm safe in saying that lace jabots fall into that category, mainstream Highland Dress in the mid-20th century but not seen much today.

    Quote Originally Posted by Dr Bee View Post

    The Sheriffmuir doublet opens up a few more possibilities...
    For sure with recently introduced things there's not a century or more of tradition to look at.

    My first Highland Dress catalogue, that I got in the 1970s, has the Sheriffmuir but it doesn't appear in any of my vintage catalogues 1910-1960.

    What is the earliest photo anyone can find of it?

    As I've mentioned before one of the coolest Highland outfits I've ever seen was on display on a mannequin at a Highland Games back around 1990, it was a Sheriffmuir made up in a Weathered tartan, with a matching kilt. It had that wonderful thing so hard to accomplish in design, looking simultaneously retro and cutting-edge-cool.
    Last edited by OC Richard; 4th February 20 at 06:57 AM.
    Proud Mountaineer from the Highlands of West Virginia; son of the Revolution and Civil War; first Europeans on the Guyandotte

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  6. #44
    Join Date
    22nd October 17
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    I really love the look of tartan jackets and vests, so I am also looking forward to seeing the final product.

    I will admit I also unafraid of being considered "overdressed" or odd, but anyone wearing a kilt may be seen as either or both by some members of the public. I am a bit old fashioned and try to wear the appropriate thing--even when most others are not.

    The first time I went to the Metropolitan Opera, I was a teenager and I wore black tie. The most recent time I attended (Wagner's Gotterdammerung), I wore my kilt, Prince Charlie, and the same black tie (I've only owned one). Both times I was among the dressier patrons, but I enjoyed being dressed for the event.

    During the intermission, I went to get a beverage. In the bar I met another man wearing formal national dress--a Chinese man in a full-length silk gown with a mandarin collar. He looked fabulous and we complimented one another.

    Regarding the lace cuffs snapping into the sleeve of a doublet: Chinese gowns are tailored with a similar feature, so that the long white "shirt" cuffs can be laundered separate from the gown itself. Living in China, I have one that I use for events like Chinese New Year, and I have found this feature to be quite useful.

    And I will admit I am now intrigued by the mystery Richard has brought up: when did the Sherrifmuir first appear?

    Andrew

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