Recommendations for polyviscose kilt

[Purgy]

Hi! I'm looking for a P/V kilt, I've done some of the research myself, but now I'm stuck, so I'm asking for advice/recommendation/help.
The recommendations I got so far from other members here, have mainly concerned shops in the USA, but given the cost of postage and customs costs,
recommendations for shops in Scotland or elsewhere in Europe would be more than welcome.
From the read threads, it seems to me that Marton Mills fabric has the highest quality. How to find out who is supplied by them, who uses their materials?
The semi-trad kilt from USA kilts was most often mentioned, so I’m thinking of buying something similar.
I'm a little skeptical, but certainly cautious, when I see the price of 50 GBP, and the opinions on the forum are that such material can not be below 90 USD.
Thanks in advance for all the suggestions and ideas.

[Steve Ashton]

Just a clarification -

The term PV stands for Polyester/Viscose. Viscose being the British term for Rayon.

But the term PV appears to have been adopted by the Pakistani makers and is used as a generic term for any synthetic fabric.
The most common synthetic used in Pakistan and called P/V is actually Acrylic.





As far as I know, the only kilt quality fabric actually woven in true P/V (the Poly/Rayon blend) is Marton Mills located in Otley, England.

The price difference you notice is due to the differences in the cost of the fabric to make the kilt, plus the cost of the labor to sew it. Due to these differences it is not uncommon for those in the kilt making business to be flooded by the Pakistani makers with email offers for kilts with a wholesale cost of around $12.00 - $20.00 US dollars.

At this cost almost anyone can purchase a couple hundred kilts, store them in their garage, open an Ebay store, sign up for a couple Highland Games, and call themselves a kiltmaker. The difference between the wholesale cost of $12.00 - $20.00 and the retail price of $50.00 -$150,00 is a pretty good profit margin for very little initial start-up investment.

Heck, the supplier will even supply you with a website full of photos and testimonials to the quality of your product.

And you too can ride the wave of the popularity of the kilt and make a very nice profit from a side business, Just as hundreds of others have done before you..

[Purgy]

Steve, thanks for the answer, but my dilemma still exists.
Please do not interpret the continuation of this message as any kind of advertisement or negative criticism, I will only show by a concrete example what is bothering me.
I hope and believe that clarification and possible answers will help other members as well.
I read the rules of the forum and nowhere did I find that the names of the shops should not be mentioned, if I missed it I apologize in advance and I will understand if this post is deleted.
So, I learned that the Semi-Trad kilt, 5 yards, from USA kilts costs 160 USD, Clan by Scotweb offers Essential Scotweb Casual Kilt 145 USD, 5 yards, and The Scotland Kilt Company offers Men'sSKilt - POLYVISCOSE Party kilt - 40 USD, 5 yards (So, I learned that the Semi-Trad kilt, 5 yards, from USA kilts costs 160 USD, Clan by Scotweb offers Essential Scotweb Casual Kilt 145 USD, and The Scotland Kilt Company offers Men's Kilt - POLYVISCOSE Party kilt - 40 USD. The "problem" is that both kilts from Scotland are listed under the materials: polyviscose. Experience teaches us that when something sounds too good to be true it is usually not true. But if one company sells acrylic material as polyviscose, who guarantees that another company with the same name is not even more “capable” so acrylic material sells 5 times more expensive, I hope you understand my dilemma. I am a new member of this forum and generally new to the world of kilts, so I do not recognize Pakistani or other companies because again they both boast of tradition and origin. I hope I’ve been able to clarify the problem at least a little bit, and I’m probably not the only one with that question either.

[KennethSime]

You might try KiltSociety for something in Europe. They have a nice range of PV kilts which folks seem to be pretty happy with for the money. I'm not sure if they use Marton Mills, but it's definitely PV, not acrylic.

I haven't purchased a kilt from them, but I've purchased some accessories that I'm pretty happy with, all leather or woolen goods made in Scotland that were nice enough.

[Miller6582]

I'd second Kilt Society, I bought one a few years back and was pleased with it, far better than ones you get in the tartan tat shops down the Royal Mile.

[Kylahullu]

Hi

I have one 8 yd PV kilt from Kilt Society and a PV Casual from USAKilts. The material is totally different.

The USAKilt Casual has become my "to go" kilt, used while travelling or doing whatever. It is lightweight (about 650g, same as trousers), so good to pack in carry-on, but not so warm as a woollen kilt. Does not seem to get dirty at all.
The Kilt Society -kilt material is heavier and does not hang so well. The weight about equal to a woollen kilt, maybe a bit less. Seems to show signs of wear more than the Casual, but not much.

Would I by again?
USAkilt Casual, for sure, if the one I am using goes to the kilt heaven.
Kilt Society PV, maybe, but only in 5 yd version, if they have one at that time. Right now I did not see any on their page. Their 8 yarder is just too heavy for casual use. (Well. if you intend to sit on some cold rock there is a reasonable use for that excessive amount of material in the back... but for that I have a woollen 16+oz 8 yarder. )

[Steve Ashton]

Purgy,

Yes, it is perfectly fine to give names and quote prices readily available to the public,

With that said - When looking at any item offered for sale take a few things into account

1) The cost of the raw materials - In the case of a kilt this includes the fabric, the stabilizer and interfacing, the straps and buckles and the thread.
The wholesale cost of 4 meters of Marton Mills P/V fabric (enough for an 8 yd kilt) is £50.00-£54.00.

2) The labor - Kilt making is a skilled labor job. You do not just produce a quality garment on the first go.
A machine stitched kilt can be made quicker than a hand stitched one but it still takes more than a couple of hours to do a respectable job.
Then use your local minimum wage. (Do you work for minimum wage?) The minimum wage in the UK in 2020 is £8.72per hour, $11.06cdn in Canada and $7.25usd to $15.00in the US .

3) The shop overhead - This is such things as paying the electric bill to keep the lights on, Mortgage or rent on your space, and all the little things like toilet paper, a cash register, and display shelving. Then there is shipping, taxes and duty.
All of these added to the wholesale cost of material and labor result in the retail costs to the customer.

Then take these into consideration when looking at the retail cost of a kilt and ask yourself - If the kilt is listed at £40.00, how much of that is for the fabric, how much for the labor, how much for the overhead?
Honestly, the only way to offer a kilt for £40.00 is to use inexpensive fabrics and hire labor at significantly lower rates than minimum wage.
Heck, the wholesale cost for 4 meters of Marton Mills fabric alone is more than £40.00.
4.5 hours of labor in the UK is £40.00. (the average amount of time it took me to machine stitch a kilt was 8.5 to 10.5 hours. That is a minimum of $199.00cdn in my fabric and labor costs without the overhead.)(Most hand stitched kilt makers charge between $350.00usd and $450.00usd for their labor alone. That works out to right about minimum wage.)

If what you are looking for is a Pub Kilt that you can spill a beer on, or trash playing paint ball, then maybe a £40.00 kilt is what you need.

If you want a kilt to go to dinner with your wife, or for more formal occasions like a wedding, then perhaps a £40.00 would not be the best choice.

Oh, and as an aside, just because a kilt is made in, or sold in, Scotland is no guarantee of a quality garment. Just walk down the Royal Mile of Edinburgh to see that fact. Many of the most skilled kilt makers are in N. America.

[MichiganKyle]

What I can tell you from my experience in the USA is that I absolutely love my USA Kilts casual kilts, which are known to use actual honest-to-goodness P/V. I also have Sport Kilts which say they're made from P/V but are a completely different material which I suspect to be mislabelled acrylic.

There are a couple ways I've seen to be able to distinguish what a kiltmaker uses without first buying one.

For one, check if it says it's Teflon-coated. AFAIK, the only time I've seen this is if the tartan is from Marton Mills. This isn't a guarantee that you're getting MM fabric, and the lack of saying it's Teflon-coated doesn't mean it isn't MM, but it's one indicator.

Another way is by looking at the tartans they offer. Marton Mills only offers P/V in a limited range of tartans unless you have them do a custom weave (USA Kilts has several custom weaves from them). But if the bulk of the tartans are on Marton Mills's Balmoral line list, it's a decent indicator. That's part of the reason I suspect Sport Kilt to be mislabelled acrylic - they offer the St. Patrick's tartan, which is one of my favorites but I've only ever found woven in acrylic or wool.

But if you can get a first-hand recommendation from someone on here, all the better. Unfortunately the only recommendation I've got for what it sounds like you're looking for would be either a USA Kilts casual kilt or a semi-traditional. But as mentioned by others here, there are other reputable folks who might be closer. I just love my USA Kilts casuals and keep buying them.

[FossilHunter]

USAKILTS only uses genuine Marton Mills PV fabric. I would assume that Scotweb does as well (their website states that they use “UK made lightweight polyviscose”). I believe a reputable company will be very upfront about what they use if you contact them and if they are not, I would not buy anything from them.

Steve, thanks for the answer, but my dilemma still exists.
Please do not interpret the continuation of this message as any kind of advertisement or negative criticism, I will only show by a concrete example what is bothering me.
I hope and believe that clarification and possible answers will help other members as well.
I read the rules of the forum and nowhere did I find that the names of the shops should not be mentioned, if I missed it I apologize in advance and I will understand if this post is deleted.
So, I learned that the Semi-Trad kilt, 5 yards, from USA kilts costs 160 USD, Clan by Scotweb offers Essential Scotweb Casual Kilt 145 USD, 5 yards, and The Scotland Kilt Company offers Men'sSKilt - POLYVISCOSE Party kilt - 40 USD, 5 yards (So, I learned that the Semi-Trad kilt, 5 yards, from USA kilts costs 160 USD, Clan by Scotweb offers Essential Scotweb Casual Kilt 145 USD, and The Scotland Kilt Company offers Men's Kilt - POLYVISCOSE Party kilt - 40 USD. The "problem" is that both kilts from Scotland are listed under the materials: polyviscose. Experience teaches us that when something sounds too good to be true it is usually not true. But if one company sells acrylic material as polyviscose, who guarantees that another company with the same name is not even more “capable” so acrylic material sells 5 times more expensive, I hope you understand my dilemma. I am a new member of this forum and generally new to the world of kilts, so I do not recognize Pakistani or other companies because again they both boast of tradition and origin. I hope I’ve been able to clarify the problem at least a little bit, and I’m probably not the only one with that question either.

[Purgy]

Hi! Thank you all for your participation, opinions, experiences and constructive advices, based on all that, I decided to contact the proposed three stores.
As soon as I get them, I will share answers here with you.