Going to wear your Full Trouser?

[OC Richard]

I think I've mentioned this before, but I can't find the old thread.

My old Pipe Major, who kept very busy piping at weddings and funerals, would be amused, even exasperated, when a client would ask if he was "going to wear his Full Kilt".

"One of these days", he would say, "I'm going to tell one of these people 'actually for your event I was thinking about wearing my Half Kilt' just to see what they say."

In trying to explain it to a musician friend (non-piper who does orchestra gigs) I said "what if somebody hired you for a gig and asked you to wear your Full Trouser? What would you think? What would you say?"

A term like "full kilt" wouldn't exist in a vacuum; there must be degrees of kilt to be distinguished. Most likely there would be a "half kilt". Perhaps a "3/4 kilt" as well.

Of course it's all nonsense. There's no more a Half Kilt than there is a Half Trouser.

But where did the term Full Kilt come from? It's not super common, but it's not rare either. I would say that I get asked to wear my Full Kilt around once a year.

There are analogies, there are other bogus fanciful terms that The General Public use.

I work at Disneyland and visitors have a talent for generating new names for things in the Park. I would say that less than half of the tourists call The Haunted Mansion by its name. Almost no one called The Main Street Electrical Parade by its name (for some unknown reason everyone called it the "electric light parade").

[kilted redleg]

OC

As a fellow piper I think that term relates to what in the regiments is referred to as "full dress" or number "one class". People who hire pipers think we all have a complete dress outfit. That would be my guess. Hope you get your answer. By the way I did not serve in her Majesty's service just Uncle Sam, and I hope I got the clothing titles correct.

[RichardtheLarge]

My best guess is that “full kilt” is a malapropism combining kilt and “full kit”, which would make more sense...as in, are you going to wear all of the stuff?

I have heard this same expression many times over the years in the States.

[OC Richard]

Yes it's a possibility that people have heard the term "full dress" but know that a kilt is not a dress

However I wouldn't have thought that members of the General Public in the US would be familiar with the term "full dress" (the equivalent in both the US Army and the US Marine Corps is "Dress Blues").

In like manner the term "full kit" is British. In the US "kit" is used in compound terms like "tool kit" and "sewing kit" but by itself only means a baby fox.

(The English football term "kit clash" is mysterious to Americans, who would use "uniform" rather than "kit". Besides "kit clash" is impossible in US baseball and gridiron anyway.)

[kingandrew]

I remember several years ago on another kilt discussion board, a young woman who was trying to help her boyfriend get his kilt outfit together commented that "you kilt wearers have more accessories than a prom queen." She wasn't wrong.

So I am guessing what people mean by "full kilt" is not just the kilt itself, but the many dress accessories they associate with it.

While many of us on this forum are accustomed to the idea of a gent wearing a kilt with hiking boots and a polo shirt, that is not the image most of the public would conjure up. In my experience, they are looking for a sporran, kilt hose, a kilt jacket, and some sort of bonnet. And many are likely picturing a full military pipe major's uniform, possibly including a feather bonnet. Many people are surprised to see a day wear outfit, when they picture kilts accompanied by the Prince Charlie, a fly plaid, and a horsehair sporran.

We must remember that the images of the kilt most have seen are of marching soldiers on the tins of shortbread, pipe bands advertising whiskey, productions of "Brigadoon," or "Outlander." So their expectations of kilted attire are likely to be elaborate, fanciful, and probably anachronistic.

On the other hand, people are genuinely curious to learn more about the clothes I wear with my kilt. Of course, they are especially curious about what I might be wearing underneath.

Andrew

[Jock Scot]

I remember several years ago on another kilt discussion board, a young woman who was trying to help her boyfriend get his kilt outfit together commented that "you kilt wearers have more accessories than a prom queen." She wasn't wrong.

So I am guessing what people mean by "full kilt" is not just the kilt itself, but the many dress accessories they associate with it.

While many of us on this forum are accustomed to the idea of a gent wearing a kilt with hiking boots and a polo shirt, that is not the image most of the public would conjure up. In my experience, they are looking for a sporran, kilt hose, a kilt jacket, and some sort of bonnet. And many are likely picturing a full military pipe major's uniform, possibly including a feather bonnet. Many people are surprised to see a day wear outfit, when they picture kilts accompanied by the Prince Charlie, a fly plaid, and a horsehair sporran.

We must remember that the images of the kilt most have seen are of marching soldiers on the tins of shortbread, pipe bands advertising whiskey, productions of "Brigadoon," or "Outlander." So their expectations of kilted attire are likely to be elaborate, fanciful, and probably anachronistic.

On the other hand, people are genuinely curious to learn more about the clothes I wear with my kilt. Of course, they are especially curious about what I might be wearing underneath.

Andrew

Exactly so. We see it here on this website quite regularly, when a newcomer to kilt attire posts his kilt attire “shopping list” here and then is persuaded, sometimes with some difficulty that much of the contents of that list is unnecessary, by the more experienced kilt wearers. Even then, to many old hands with kilt attire, the “basic list” is often still too long.

[Pleater]

I keep thinking of the expression 'the whole kit and caboodle' - but that is something different - probably.

Anne the Pleater

[Jock Scot]

I keep thinking of the expression 'the whole kit and caboodle' - but that is something different - probably.

Anne the Pleater

Entirely appropriate, I would say Anne.

[OC Richard]

I am guessing what people mean by "full kilt" is not just the kilt itself, but the many dress accessories they associate with it.

While many of us on this forum are accustomed to the idea of a gent wearing a kilt with hiking boots and a polo shirt, that is not the image most of the public would conjure up. In my experience, they are looking for a sporran, kilt hose, a kilt jacket, and some sort of bonnet.

Yes you've put your finger right on it.

However in the piping community and overall Scottish community I grew up in "kilts" has always been used as a shorthand equivalent to "Highland Dress" or "Highland outfit".

"Will you be kilted?" or "I think most people will be in kilts" has always meant, in the circles I've been in, men in Highland Dress/Highland outfits.

It's always inferred not only the kilt itself but appropriate hose, shoes, sporran, and shirt at the very least.

And in the piping community has always meant, in addition, necktie, waistcoat or jacket, and bonnet.

What it hasn't mean was showing up in a kilt sans any other item of Highland Dress, say, a kilt with trainers and t-shirt.

Of course "casual kilting" and utility kilts didn't exist for the majority of the time I've been wearing Highland Dress.

And these things still aren't a reality in the piping community, from what I've seen. Any piper would as a matter of course appear in kilt, hose, shoes, sporran, collared shirt, necktie, waistcoat or jacket, and bonnet.

Still, to me the term "full kilt" is amusing, and foreign to Highland Dress.

[RichardtheLarge]

One other idea—maybe a kilt worn with a jacket can be a “half kilt” and when a piper’s plaid or day plaid is added it becomes a “full kilt”—that is, both halves are now present.