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  1. #1
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    Exclamation Nuanced decision regarding my first NEW Kilt and matching bias cut waistcoat

    Good evening all,

    This is by no means my first kilt, but I have been very frugal over the years and have tons of kilts, but have never purchased a brand new of my own!

    I have ordered a swatch of a Murphy Muted, MacDonald Modern, and MacArthur Modern.

    I really like the dark color of MacDonald and my 3rd great grandmother was Mary McDonald. She married my 3rd great grandfather in Glasgow, but I'm not certain of anything regarding her father's side. Father's name was John McDonald a foundry laborer, mother was a Rose Kelly. I once found a couple that I thought might be her parents, but determined they weren't.

    I know that a lot of the familial tartan trend is much more of a recent phenomenon, but I do enjoy the idea as a bit of traditionalist.

    On the other hand I really want a Murphy kilt, but at the same time found the Murphy tartan to be a bit of a gimmick being a variation of MacLean of Duart, and also being called Tara which has very little to do with the Murphys of Muskerry or Wexford for that matter.

    I think my ultimatel goal in the future is to establish something similar to what Clan Cian has going. A Clan Laighin tartan. The Laighin have spread throughout Ireland and the Isles and have a number of Y DNA signatures that fall in line with the Irish Pedigrees to an incredibly consistent level. I think it would be nice to have a tartan that could engage members in history woven with DNA while establishing a new tradition. I don't know. I'm probably in well over my head, but that's never stopped me before. Hahahaha.

    I like the MacArthur Modern tartan and can bear to have one, but at the same time feel a bit odd if I were to go with that as my first without having a MacArthur in my family tree.

    I think the swatches will certainly sway me in one direction over another, but I'd appreciate any input from fellow kilt enthusiasts.

    Always looking for more Murphy men to join the Murphy DNA project at familytreedna for a Y DNA test. I am looking to bring more enthusiasm to Irish genealogy and hoping to get more folks into kilts along the way.

    Kevin Murphy

  2. #2
    Join Date
    21st May 10
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    Kevin;
    I'm married to a Murphy so we've done some research on the family. If your Murphys are from the south of Ireland, then MacArthur would be acceptable as the Murphys in County Cork were a sept of the Irish MacArthur Clan. If you family came from the east of Ireland they were a sept of the Scottish McDonald Clan and the MacArthur tartan wouldn't be appropriate.
    Hope this helps.
    BD
    B.D. Marshall
    Texas Convener for Clan Keith

  3. #3
    Join Date
    26th April 19
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    Quote Originally Posted by bdkilted View Post
    Kevin;
    I'm married to a Murphy so we've done some research on the family. If your Murphys are from the south of Ireland, then MacArthur would be acceptable as the Murphys in County Cork were a sept of the Irish MacArthur Clan. If you family came from the east of Ireland they were a sept of the Scottish McDonald Clan and the MacArthur tartan wouldn't be appropriate.
    Hope this helps.
    BD
    Thank you! I had no idea that the MacArthurs had any connection to the Murphys in Munster.

    The overwhelming majority of any Murphy men who have traced their lineage to the Province of Munster in general fit into the modal Murphy family of the project through Y DNA testing.

    The Wexford, Leinster Murphys in general, cluster with the modal Cavanagh family of their DNA project and a large number of Kinsella men. They are certainly descended from Diarmaid Mac Murchadha the King of Leinster as these families are descended from two of Diarmaid's sons who are the progenitors of those families.

    Interestingly enough both of these families descended from Énnae Censellach, King of Leinster in the 5th Century, according to historical sources. So both families independently adopted the same surname albeit through a different evolution. The Y DNA SNP/Haplogroupe that both of our families share dates to the time contemporary with Énnae Censellach.

    The oldest SNP that can be confidently stated as Murphy in origin, pertaining to the Munster Murphys, is R-Z18138. Interestingly enough the age estimation methods put this SNP in the window of time that Dermod Muimneach O'Moroghoe, said to be the first of the family to enter Munster, lived. It is said he brought his family to Munster in the 13th century.

    Thanks again B.D. Marshall!

  4. #4
    Join Date
    9th April 21
    Location
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    Very interesting research you've done. My Murray line only briefly came via Ireland, but growing up in Savannah entrentched an affitniity for its culture and history. I then married an O'Neill from Kerry and I helped dive into her family history. Of course I found connection (as best as i could) going back to the ancient Uí Néill's through Munster as well as looking through her mother's family (Fitzmaurices) history which directly came from the Earls/Barons of Kerry and earlier Norman invaders. Ive even got a research service order pending at the NLI, Dublin (now that covid reg's are being lifted) to get some family war records from the Irish War of Independence. Fascinating stuff.

    I share your desire to find the 'authentic' connection in my tartan/clan affiliation. While not having the Murray name myself, the connection came from my grandmothers maiden name and the first bit of family history I latched on to as a kid.
    As to your actual question on tartan selection, I always defer to going with what just feels the best to you (especially given that you've already established your 'connection' to each of your solid choices), which is of course very unhelpful advice. However, my two cents would just be to endorse anything in the 'muted' palate. Just got my HoE muted Murray kilt a few weeks ago and the colors are fantastic and unique. Pictures dont do it justice or accuracy. While I went on descriptions and recommendations, ordering the swatches was a good call. Cheers!

  5. #5
    Join Date
    21st March 17
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    I’m one of those who chose to just stick to the one clan I am closest too. It makes buying kilts much more affordable as I don’t need more than a few (or even one).

    I would just pick the clan you're closest to and run with that.

    Edit: having read more of your post, I would go with Macdonald as it is both an actual highland clan and you have more solid connections to it.

    It also has a large variety of tartans associated with it so you can pick a tartan your happy with while still choosing a clan tartan.
    Last edited by FossilHunter; 21st June 21 at 10:41 AM.
    Descendant of the Gillises and MacDonalds of North Morar.

  6. The Following User Says 'Aye' to FossilHunter For This Useful Post:


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