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  1. #21
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    Quote Originally Posted by Iain Ruaidh View Post
    UK Military tailoring can be a bit varied!
    It was far superior to everyone else's! Nice material, probably from a bygone age as this was not the pile em high and push em through bootcamp the original coat came from.
    It's a bit of an aside but my go-to raingear is a RN surplus coat that has a zip-out liner. Somehow it found it's way across the pond. It's long enough to cover all but the last inch or so of a kilt.
    I just made the rash assumption the the British military might know a bit about wet weather.
    Last edited by Brian Rose; 7th August 22 at 08:20 PM.

  2. #22
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    Quote Originally Posted by Patty Logan View Post
    Even if you were a officer could you choose to wear the other ranks uniform?
    I don't think it would ever go that far, for one thing officers need to follow the customs of their regiment (and the army as a whole). Part of it was the traditional British class system, a dichotomy between the upper and lower classes. Traditionally officers were drawn from the upper class and dressing as commoners wouldn't have felt right either in uniform or in mufti.

    Even in the USA it was unusual that Grant, the highest-ranking general in the army, often wore a privates' jacket and was sometimes mistaken for a common soldier unless his epaulettes were seen.

    In the old days British officers purchased their commissions, meaning that Lord So-and-so might purchase a Subaltern's commission for his second son, along with all of his kit.
    Last edited by OC Richard; 8th August 22 at 03:17 AM.
    Proud Mountaineer from the Highlands of West Virginia; son of the Revolution and Civil War; first Europeans on the Guyandotte

  3. #23
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    A bit of an aside, but being puzzled about the strangely small-sett Royal Stewart kilts lately worn by the pipers of the 1SCOTS (Royal Scots Borderers) I took a look at the kilts of their antecedent regiments.

    The Royal Scots Borderers was the result of the amalgamation of The Royal Scots and the Kings Own Scottish Borderers in 2006.

    First, here on the left is the small-sett RS, apparently the same fabric used for their bag-covers. (Note how close the stripes come to the bottom of the kilt.) The piper to right is wearing a larger-sett kilt, seemingly not the huge ORs' sett but something like ordinary 16oz kilting cloth.



    About the tartan of the two antecedent regiments' pipers, here's the Royal Scots (around 2000) wearing the ordinary larger-sett Royal Stewart Other Ranks kilts, but seeming to have slightly smaller-set 16oz plaids.



    and this photo of KOSB pipers (around 2000) apparently showing the Pipe Major and Pipe Sergeant wearing the slightly smaller 16oz Royal Stewart fabric such as seen on the Black Watch Pipe Major in my earlier post.

    Note the bag-covers are in a yet smaller sett.

    Last edited by OC Richard; 8th August 22 at 04:39 AM.
    Proud Mountaineer from the Highlands of West Virginia; son of the Revolution and Civil War; first Europeans on the Guyandotte

  4. #24
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    Quote Originally Posted by OC Richard View Post
    A bit of an aside, but being puzzled about the strangely small-sett Royal Stewart kilts lately worn by the pipers of the 1SCOTS (Royal Scots Borderers) I took a look at the kilts of their antecedent regiments.

    The Royal Scots Borderers was the result of the amalgamation of The Royal Scots and the Kings Own Scottish Borderers in 2006.

    First, here on the left is the small-sett RS, apparently the same fabric used for their bag-covers. (Note how close the stripes come to the bottom of the kilt.) The piper to right is wearing a larger-sett kilt, seemingly not the huge ORs' sett but something like ordinary 16oz kilting cloth.

    About the tartan of the two antecedent regiments' pipers, here's the Royal Scots (around 2000) wearing the ordinary larger-sett Royal Stewart Other Ranks kilts, but seeming to have slightly smaller-set 16oz plaids.

    and this photo of KOSB pipers (around 2000) apparently showing the Pipe Major and Pipe Sergeant wearing the slightly smaller 16oz Royal Stewart fabric such as seen on the Black Watch Pipe Major in my earlier post.

    Note the bag-covers are in a yet smaller sett.
    I suspect this has more to do with MOD procurement having been contracted out some years ago and the company that now provides almost every from clothing to pharmaceuticals and much more are not held to account. Add to the cost cutting, the fact that may of the older QMs and RSMs who would have maintained the standards have retired and the current ones donít know, or canít enforce, the tradition.

    This contracting out was responsible for the dreadful first rum of the Government tartan when the RRS was formed, plus the sub-contracting of the Horse-hair sporrans to Pakistan. Fortunately, some Royal displeasure and asking difficult questions resolved the sporran issue and they are now back with Margaret Morrison Ltd.

  5. The Following 3 Users say 'Aye' to figheadair For This Useful Post:


  6. #25
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    Quote Originally Posted by Patty Logan View Post
    Even if you were a officer could you choose to wear the other ranks uniform?
    Probably not, nor would you! To add to Richard's comments, rank went along with class - and so traditionally, most officers would have their own tailor, whereas ORs got what they got. There are historic photos of ORs in kilts that are pulled just about all the way up to their armpits. The only measurement that mattered was where there bottom of the kilt fell.

    Still today officers are expected to provide their own mess uniforms. It is a long standing tradition.
    Last edited by plaid preacher; 10th August 22 at 07:42 AM.

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  8. #26
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    Here are some vintage photos showing the old uber-high ORs' kilts.

    Such photos are few and far between, as soldiers rarely were photographed without their jackets.



    More recent photos of two RSMs in shirtsleeve order.

    Note that the two men are of markedly different height, and their kilts come up to rather different places vis-a-vis their pockets.

    Last edited by OC Richard; 9th August 22 at 06:24 PM.
    Proud Mountaineer from the Highlands of West Virginia; son of the Revolution and Civil War; first Europeans on the Guyandotte

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  10. #27
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    Quote Originally Posted by OC Richard View Post
    Here are some vintage photos showing the old uber-high ORs' kilts.

    Such photos are few and far between, as soldiers rarely were photographed without their jackets.



    More recent photos of two RSMs in shirtsleeve order.

    Note that the two men are of markedly different height, and their kilts come up to rather different places vis-a-vis their pockets.

    Richard to the rescue. It was the chap who seems to be throwing a football that I specifically had in mind.

  11. #28
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    Quote Originally Posted by plaid preacher View Post
    It was the chap who seems to be throwing a football that I specifically had in mind.
    A stone, I would think.
    Proud Mountaineer from the Highlands of West Virginia; son of the Revolution and Civil War; first Europeans on the Guyandotte

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