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  1. #331
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    Quote Originally Posted by OC Richard View Post
    Thing is, there are two standard widths. Almost certainly this would be for the wider of the two.

    Since at least the 1840s the standard civilian "dirk belts" or waistbelts were 2.5 inches wide.

    At that time the Cameron Highlanders put their pipers into a civilian kit with dark green doublets, dark blue Glengarries, and black leather sword belts and dirk belts with silver buckles and fittings, all of these things new to the military, and in the army worn only by the six pipers of that battalion.

    Here they are! At the far left. The only men in dark green jackets, the only men in doublets, the only men wearing Glengarries, the only men with black wide dirk belts and sword belts with silver fittings.



    Ironically this entirely civilian outfit is now what people call "military piper's dress" or "number one dress".

    Those dirk belts and sword belts (waistbelts and crossbelts) were standard in civilian Highland Dress throughout the Victorian period.



    Here are some styles, note that the waistbelt buckles were made in both portrait and landscape orientation



    However after 1900 civilian Highland Dress became simplified, and divested itself of most of the traditional impedimenta. Thus dirks and the belts that supported them ceased to be worn in mainstream civilian Highland Dress.



    Then around 1930 a new civilian Evening Dress jacket was invented, the Montrose, ending at the waist all around (in Victorian terminology a "shell jacket").



    A new style of waistbelt, purely ornamental (as a dirk wasn't worn) was invented specifically for this jacket, narrower, at 2.25 inches. New buckle styles were invented for this belt.

    Here's the buckle most often seen. There's also a common thistle style, and a so-called "bullseye" (goddess-eye) version.



    This narrower Montrose belt or civilian Evening Dress belt is what's regarded as a "civilian kilt belt" nowadays.
    A quick google search suggests that the 2.5 belts are fairly uncommon. The buckle may still be worth placing a bid on...
    Descendant of the Gillises and MacDonalds of North Morar.

  2. #332
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    This one is like the Pound Shops in Britain



    A seal Evening sporran, which has every appearance of being from a legitimate UK maker, for a pound.

    https://www.ebay.com/itm/32462167465...ndition=4%7C10
    Last edited by OC Richard; 14th May 21 at 05:56 AM.
    Proud Mountaineer from the Highlands of West Virginia; son of the Revolution and Civil War; first Europeans on the Guyandotte

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  4. #333
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    Very satisfied with my ebay gamble

    sporran.jpg

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  6. #334
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    Quote Originally Posted by OC Richard View Post

    A seal Evening sporran, which has every appearance of being from a legitimate UK maker, for a pound.

    [/url]
    On close inspection it is marked as being from Janet Eagleton in Perth.

    Regards, EEM.
    "Humanity is an aspiration, not a fact of everyday life."

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  8. #335
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    Quote Originally Posted by MurrayInGA View Post
    Very satisfied with my ebay gamble

    sporran.jpg
    That's beautiful!

    My favourite sort of Day sporran, with the seal front.
    Proud Mountaineer from the Highlands of West Virginia; son of the Revolution and Civil War; first Europeans on the Guyandotte

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  10. #336
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    Here's a classic basic brown leather Day sporran, from the looks of it Scottish-made, though lacking stamps.

    https://www.ebay.com/itm/30400018652...ndition=4%7C10

    Odd about the middle tassel. We would have to see a photo showing the inside to be sure, but I'm guessing that the tassel is the same length as the others, it's just been pushed inside.

    Now here's a classic seal Evening sporran for under $50 (including shipping) with the standard Celtic/Runic silverplate cantle. It has the typical gold oval Made In Scotland Real Leather stamp.

    Too bad there's damage to the fur. The price, for the cantle alone, is a bargain.

    https://www.ebay.com/itm/17476878686...ndition=4%7C10
    Last edited by OC Richard; 19th May 21 at 04:29 AM.
    Proud Mountaineer from the Highlands of West Virginia; son of the Revolution and Civil War; first Europeans on the Guyandotte

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  12. #337
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    Quote Originally Posted by OC Richard View Post
    Here's a classic basic brown leather Day sporran, from the looks of it Scottish-made, though lacking stamps.

    https://www.ebay.com/itm/30400018652...ndition=4%7C10

    Odd about the middle tassel. We would have to see a photo showing the inside to be sure, but I'm guessing that the tassel is the same length as the others, it's just been pushed inside.
    Hey, Richard, I was just looking at this sporran. There's no indication where it's made, and the seller isn't sure. You think it's Scottish made?

    And it looks like the seller has added a picture where the middle tassle is extended out to its full length. Nice looking little vintage piece.

  13. #338
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    Quote Originally Posted by JPS View Post
    Hey, Richard, I was just looking at this sporran. There's no indication where it's made, and the seller isn't sure. You think it's Scottish made?

    And it looks like the seller has added a picture where the middle tassle is extended out to its full length. Nice looking little vintage piece.
    It's not 100% of course, but I've seen enough Scottish-made and Pakistani-made sporrans that I can usually distinguish between the two. There are puzzlers sometimes!

    Often it's little things that give Pakistani sporrans away, perhaps the shape and/or placement of the leather tab on the back for the strap to go through, or the shape of the "bells", or the quality of the casting of the cantle (the Pakistani ones are nearly always re-casts from Scottish originals and have less detail).

    In any case that one "feels right" to me.

    Now here's one that doesn't feel right to me https://www.ebay.com/itm/36340442559...ndition=4%7C10

    It's getting bids so it must look good to at least two people!

    But I think it's Pakistani. Why? On sporrans there's usually a piece of leather under the cantle, following the shape of the cantle, sort of a gasket/liner/washer. I wish I knew the proper term.

    On top-quality sporrans this liner follows the outline of the cantle closely, and traditionally has been cut with pinking shears giving a zig-zag or toothed edge.

    On this Ebay sporran the liner is thin and cheap-looking, perhaps vinyl.

    Also there's the shape of the bells. Traditionally they're spherical, but quite often on Pakistani sporrans the bells are slightly elongated, with flattened sides.
    Last edited by OC Richard; 3rd June 21 at 03:14 AM.
    Proud Mountaineer from the Highlands of West Virginia; son of the Revolution and Civil War; first Europeans on the Guyandotte

  14. #339
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    Quote Originally Posted by OC Richard View Post
    It's not 100% of course, but I've seen enough Scottish-made and Pakistani-made sporrans that I can usually distinguish between the two. There are puzzlers sometimes!

    Often it's little things that give Pakistani sporrans away, perhaps the shape and/or placement of the leather tab on the back for the strap to go through, or the shape of the "bells", or the quality of the casting of the cantle (the Pakistani ones are nearly always re-casts from Scottish originals and have less detail).

    In any case that one "feels right" to me.

    Now here's one that doesn't feel right to me https://www.ebay.com/itm/36340442559...ndition=4%7C10

    It's getting bids so it must look good to at least two people!

    But I think it's Pakistani. Why? On sporrans there's usually a piece of leather under the cantle, following the shape of the cantle, sort of a gasket/liner/washer. I wish I knew the proper term.

    On top-quality sporrans this liner follows the outline of the cantle closely, and traditionally has been cut with pinking shears giving a zig-zag or toothed edge.

    On this Ebay sporran the liner is thin and cheap-looking, perhaps vinyl.

    Also there's the shape of the bells. Traditionally they're spherical, but quite often on Pakistani sporrans the bells are slightly elongated, with flattened sides.
    I see what you're saying there, and I appreciate the help in spotting the signs. I like this sporran's simple design, and--I don't know--the patina and the little flaws make it kind of charming.

    And I can see what you're talking about on that dress sporran, particularly when compared with this one, which has such a prominent...umm...gasket.

  15. #340
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    Just had another look at the plain brown/ginger leather one, I'm pretty sure it's legit.

    Here's another lovely one.

    The fur looks like pony, or perhaps bovine. Not seal anyhow, so legal to ship to the USA.

    https://www.ebay.com/itm/18485877528...ndition=4%7C10
    Proud Mountaineer from the Highlands of West Virginia; son of the Revolution and Civil War; first Europeans on the Guyandotte

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