Advice few sewing box pleats?

[ardchoille]

It is interesting that box pleats look the same on the outside and inside. So, it should work. What are you planning to do with the edges of the box pleats that aren't sewn? If these are on the inside, then you can tack them together. On the outside it is more of a concern to have them with blind, hidden stitches.

The loops will be on the inside. Once you press those down, you can hand stitch them and it won't matter what the stitching looks like because they will be covered with a liner (inside of the kilt) - you can't see the inside of the fell when the kilt is being worn anyway. When you press down the loops and turn the material over, you will be looking at the box pleats as seen from the outside of the kilt (which were machine stitched from the inside).

I'm going to use this technique to make a couple of kilts. Sewing the pleats should take about 15 minutes or less instead of the 10 hours or more required with hand sewing.

[Alan H]

Well,my method won't work 'cause I think you've already sewn the inside edges to each other. And in fact, you're hosed by having done that, because due to the taper in the pleats, which is quite large in a box pleat kilt, the inside edges overlap each other up by the waist,rather than lying edge to edge.

At least I think you've already sewn the inside edges together.

I'd recommend ripping them out, if you have, and then doing as Barb suggested.

[ardchoille]

Well,my method won't work 'cause I think you've already sewn the inside edges to each other. And in fact, you're hosed by having done that, because due to the taper in the pleats, which is quite large in a box pleat kilt, the inside edges overlap each other up by the waist,rather than lying edge to edge.

At least I think you've already sewn the inside edges together.

I'd recommend ripping them out, if you have, and then doing as Barb suggested.

It seems it would be easy to incorporate tapering in as you're drawing the lines before sewing.

[Bugbear]

Oh! Barb's sewing the outside parts of the kilt together, and the loops are on the inside side of the kilt... Now it all makes sense. Thanks Alan and Barb and all the rest of you. Not that I'll ever make a kilt, but I wanted to understand.

[Alan H]

It seems it would be easy to incorporate tapering in as you're drawing the lines before sewing.

Did you draw your taper lines...aka pleat edgelines on the tartan in chalk?

I agree, that's a good idea, and the chalk will brush out with a toothbrush. Don't use a dressmakers pencil, though, whatever you do! That doesn't brush out!

Just as an aside, I started sewing my California Tartan box pleat exactly as Barb has suggested. After meticulously sewing one pleat I realized that I could pin the thing in place and machine-sew the pleats ten times faster and the stitching would be invisible as well as half-again stronger.

So I did.

[ardchoille]

Did you draw your taper lines...aka pleat edgelines on the tartan in chalk?

I agree, that's a good idea, and the chalk will brush out with a toothbrush. Don't use a dressmakers pencil, though, whatever you do! That doesn't brush out!

Just as an aside, I started sewing my California Tartan box pleat exactly as Barb has suggested. After meticulously sewing one pleat I realized that I could pin the thing in place and machine-sew the pleats ten times faster and the stitching would be invisible as well as half-again stronger.

So I did.

Yes, I drew the taper lines with a piece of tailor's chalk, it brushes out fine. Also, most of what I'm doing was taken from your excellent X-Kilt tutorial. I need to buy my own sewing machine soon.

[Barb T]

OK - just so it's clear, I'll try describing it again. I think some of you have got it, but I think there's still some confusion. And the method below doesn't work really well with outside top stitching, so I'm assuming that you're stitching by hand. I'm sorry that I'm not home right now - I'm in San Jose. If I were home, I'd sketch it and scan it and post it, but I can't do that from out here.

For clarification, stitching box pleats is _not_ done by folding two pleat edges toward one another and then stitching the two edges together. So, it helps to completely take it out of your head that you are making box pleats. The box comes later.

Here goes again with another attempt at a description!!

Don't worry about doing this on a kilt. Just grab any piece of plain fabric and a hand full of pins. Once you get the idea on something without stripes, you can then stitch your kilt.

-Lay the cloth out long ways away from you on a table. Mark 4 width-wise lines on the fabric as follows. Mark the first one 12" from the edge that's nearest to you. Mark the next one 4" farther away. Then mark one 2" from that. Then put the fourth line 4" from line 3. Don't worry at this point if you can't see why. Just do it.

-Go to your first line, fold the cloth along the line, and pin the edge to hold the fold.

-Bring the pinned fold to the second chalk line, and pin _through only one thickness below_. Stitch the edge of the fold through only one thickness. This does not look like a box pleat, but it will eventually. Trust me.

-Then go to the next line you chalked (line 3), fold along that line and pin to hold.

-Line this new fold up with line four, pin, and stitch edge through one thickness below.

Now, if you look at what you have, you have two seams, and one "tube" or loop of fabric behind each of the seams. Place the cloth with the seam side down on the table, and the "tubes" up. Flatten each tube, laying half the tube down on one side of the seam and half on the other. Voila - an instant box pleat from each tube.

[ChattanCat]

Did you draw your taper lines...aka pleat edgelines on the tartan in chalk?

I agree, that's a good idea, and the chalk will brush out with a toothbrush. Don't use a dressmakers pencil, though, whatever you do! That doesn't brush out!

Just as an aside, I started sewing my California Tartan box pleat exactly as Barb has suggested. After meticulously sewing one pleat I realized that I could pin the thing in place and machine-sew the pleats ten times faster and the stitching would be invisible as well as half-again stronger.

So I did.

I think that we have two different methods and both will work. If you are hand sewing, then you want to do a pleat at a time as Barb suggests.

If you are machine sewing then folding each pleat then machine sewing from the inside makes sense to me.

Keep in mind that the seam does not need to be stronger because it is the canvas that is carriing the load, not the sewn pleats. You should always put in canvas to relieve the stress of the buckles and belts from the pleats and aprons.

[hospitaller]

I guess we need graphics as I've just tried Barb's second description literally, and all I end up with is 2 knife pleats with the 2 tubes she describes, but one points up theother points down, and since the edges are both pinned at the same place, there is no way to flatten them.

I think she missed the word UP in this step:

-Then go to the next line you chalked (line 3), fold UP along that line and pin to hold.

This way, the only way you can line up lines 3 and 4 is 'on top'

Without the UP you end up with a series of knife pleats.

[ardchoille]

OK - just so it's clear, I'll try describing it again. I think some of you have got it, but I think there's still some confusion. And the method below doesn't work really well with outside top stitching, so I'm assuming that you're stitching by hand. I'm sorry that I'm not home right now - I'm in San Jose. If I were home, I'd sketch it and scan it and post it, but I can't do that from out here.

For clarification, stitching box pleats is _not_ done by folding two pleat edges toward one another and then stitching the two edges together. So, it helps to completely take it out of your head that you are making box pleats. The box comes later.

Here goes again with another attempt at a description!!

Don't worry about doing this on a kilt. Just grab any piece of plain fabric and a hand full of pins. Once you get the idea on something without stripes, you can then stitch your kilt.

-Lay the cloth out long ways away from you on a table. Mark 4 width-wise lines on the fabric as follows. Mark the first one 12" from the edge that's nearest to you. Mark the next one 4" farther away. Then mark one 2" from that. Then put the fourth line 4" from line 3. Don't worry at this point if you can't see why. Just do it.

-Go to your first line, fold the cloth along the line, and pin the edge to hold the fold.

-Bring the pinned fold to the second chalk line, and pin _through only one thickness below_. Stitch the edge of the fold through only one thickness. This does not look like a box pleat, but it will eventually. Trust me.

-Then go to the next line you chalked (line 3), fold along that line and pin to hold.

-Line this new fold up with line four, pin, and stitch edge through one thickness below.

Now, if you look at what you have, you have two seams, and one "tube" or loop of fabric behind each of the seams. Place the cloth with the seam side down on the table, and the "tubes" up. Flatten each tube, laying half the tube down on one side of the seam and half on the other. Voila - an instant box pleat from each tube.

Ok, I've mostly got it this time. thank you, Barb, for your tutelage and your patience. I'll quote the part I'm having trouble with.

"Place the cloth with the seam side down on the table, and the "tubes" up. Flatten each tube, laying half the tube down on one side of the seam and half on the other. Voila - an instant box pleat from each tube"

Once you "flatten each tube" (this makes the box pleats on the outside), how do you stitch those "tubes" down without the stitching showing? Once you flatten them, you have to do something to keep them flat, right?