lightweight tartan rejected

[OC Richard]

On this forum we have a large number of people who got into kiltwearing fairly recently, at a time when there are a vast number of kiltwearing options, and often people have posted about their Utilikilts or PV kilts or sport kilts or casual kilts or what have you, and at times these have been mentioned as a "gateway drug" to full-yardage heavyweight wool traditional kilts.

I've mentioned from time to time a couple things about my own kiltwearing and attitutude 1) that I got into kiltwearing in the mid-1970s at a time when the only kilts around were full-yardage wool traditional kilts, the only option being mediumweight or heavyweight; 2) this sort of kilt is the only kind I have ever owned or worn; and 3) that to this day the "pipe band scene" and "solo competition scene" regards only these kilts as being acceptable for band and solo piping use.

This was made clear yesterday when we had a band meeting to discuss, amongst other things, getting new kilts.

I brought in three kilts for "the lads" to see, a 16/17oz Isle of Skye, a 16/17oz Auld Scotland, and a 10/11oz MacDonald.

All the pipers who took a close look at the kilts did so not only with their eyes but also grabbed the edge to feel the fabric between their fingers, and the lightweight kilt was summarily rejected by all. (Us fellows represent, between us, over two hundred years of kiltwearing.)

Call us pipers traditionalists, or snobs. Or maybe it's just a matter of liking what we're accustomed to, and all of us have been wearing 8 yard 16oz wool kilts our entire piping lives. But it was clear that whatever tartan we go with, it will be in heavyweight wool!

[Father Bill]

I think you're right on! Frankly, I'd love to try a 22-24oz kilt.

[Spartan Tartan]

I prefer the heavier weight as well. Although, do like my heavy weight 6 yarder over a "full" 8 yarder.

[flyrod6057]

The heavier, the better!

[RockyR]

I think several things are at play here. I'll lend my experience as a kilt company owner (and kiltmaker) for almost 10 years, having roughly 50 pipe bands on file that we currently outfit (I'm not at the office so I can't count to give you a firm accurate number):

The statement I think is the most accurate is OCR's second to last sentence: " Or maybe it's just a matter of liking what we're accustomed to, and all of us have been wearing 8 yard 16oz wool kilts our entire piping lives."

Roughly 5/8 to 2/3 of the bands we outfit have 13 or 16 oz 8 Yard Wool kilts. Wool is the most traditional choice for kilts (and therefore pipe bands). Roughly 1/4 of the bands get 5 yard wool kilts and the rest get Semi Traditional (11 - 12 oz PV) kilts. IMHO, several factors contribute to that:

1. Many bands are just starting and looking to outfit an entire band in 1 go. This can get very costly when you're talking about full outfits for the entire band. If pipes cost $800 MINIMUM (most are $1500+ for a decent set) and the outfit is $1000 + (much more if you're looking for military 'look'), that's a heck of an investment for the average member to make or for a band to make for 5, 10, 20 members.

2. Since there WERE less alternatives 30+ years ago, people just accepted that they had to spend the money on a band outfit or not join the band. I don't have any numbers to back up this next statement, but several older pipers have commented to me that there are more bands and more people joining bands in the last 10 - 15 years than there had been before. Not saying it's true or accurate, just relating what they've told me.

3. A MINOR factor, but one worth noting, is that several bands we service (probably 10 or so) are from southern US states. When many of them contacted us about providing kilts, they SPECIFICALLY asked for lower yardage, PV or 13 /11 oz wool kilts. As they are afraid of being too hot in 8 yard 16 oz wool kilts in Florida humidity, Texas heat, etc, they want a cooler option. WHETHER OR NOT that makes much of a temperature difference is another issue entirely... I'm just relaying what I've found.

4. From the bands we've serviced over the last 10 years, we've seen kilt qualities ranging from high quality to VERY poor. Some bands have much higher standards of what is 'acceptable' and what is not. Many of our bands are grade 5 or street bands (low level competition or not competitive at all). Generally speaking, a higher percentage of them will get PV or 5 Yard kilts. The bands that are more serious about their competitions (our grades 3 and 4 bands) and the bands that have more $$$ (funded by their FD or PD or city or have been around for a long time) tend to get the higher end, more expensive gear.

It boils down to weighing the options of how you want to look, how competitive you want to be and the financial options... the less money a band (or individual) has and less competitive a band is, GENERALLY the less they want to spend on the accessories.

If money was no object, I'm sure many more bands would get wool kilts. Since money IS an issue with many bands (especially NEW bands), they search for ways to keep the look, but trim the costs a bit.

I'm not saying that OCR's band doesn't feel the way they do or they don't have that right to make that decision or anything like that. I'm simply stating that my experience has been a bit different having dealt with the bands that we've dealt with, probably because we offer both lower priced and higher end traditional kilts. I'd also guess that a kiltmaker ONLY making traditional kilts would only supply bands who want their traditional wool kilts. In the same way, I'm surmise a kilt company that only sells low price import kilts will probably only supply bands looking for low price kilts. Customers tend to seek out the 'level of quality' that they can afford.

[Alan H]

In contrast, I know of only one "upper echelon - top 20" North American highland athlete in the last five years who wears a full-on wool kilt. That was Larry Brock, who retired at the end of the 2011 season. The OVERWHELMING favorite kilt among the athletes you see on the field at any North American highland games is Sportkilt. I would venture a guess that 70% of North American highland athletes wear Sportkilts.

The next most-worn...and this is *way* down in percentage points, is the Stillwater standard acrylic model.

I'm inviting 30 atheltes, more or less, to the Tartan Day event at Ardenwood this coming April. Here's the breakdown:

Open Mens A&B: seven sportkilts, one Stillwater, one full-on wool
Lightweight Mens and C class mens: six sportkilts, one home-made kilt, one unknown
Masters Men: Two wool, possibly wool-blend kilts, five sportkilts, one home-made
Womens class: six sportkilts, two unknown

[Geoff Withnell]

No USAK Casuals? I'm surprised.

In contrast, I know of only one "upper echelon - top 20" North American highland athlete in the last five years who wears a full-on wool kilt. That was Larry Brock, who retired at the end of the 2011 season. The OVERWHELMING favorite kilt among the athletes you see on the field at any North American highland games is Sportkilt. I would venture a guess that 70% of North American highland athletes wear Sportkilts.

The next most-worn...and this is *way* down in percentage points, is the Stillwater standard acrylic model.

I'm inviting 30 atheltes, more or less, to the Tartan Day event at Ardenwood this coming April. Here's the breakdown:

Open Mens A&B: seven sportkilts, one Stillwater, one full-on wool
Lightweight Mens and C class mens: six sportkilts, one home-made kilt, one unknown
Masters Men: Two wool, possibly wool-blend kilts, five sportkilts, one home-made
Womens class: six sportkilts, two unknown

[EagleJCS]

As a piper in Kentucky (where we get quite a range of temperature and humidity), I'm not at all surprised at seeing that the southern states pipe bands tend to go for lighter weight kilts. The Louisville Pipe Band wears 11/13 oz. wool kilts, and sometimes after a late spring or early fall event the liner around my waist is completely soaked through with perspiration when I get home & take my kilt off. (We generally take mid/late June and July off as it's too hot and humid out to kilt up.)

I'm also not at all suprised about Alan's experience that the athletes wear the less expensive poly/blend kilts. Were I to be participating in the heavy athletics I, too, would wear something that I'm not afraid to get dirty and/or tear that would clean up easily (washing machine) or be easily replaced.

[Alan H]

I "push" USA Kilts casuals pretty strongly to athletes, and a few have taken me up on it, but the culture just goes with SportKilts, and considering what we do, and what they guys/gals on the field are primarily into, it makes sense.

Maybe a quarter of these athletes also own very nice wool kilts, which they wear to more formal occasions. That' sjust a guess, it might be more like 10-15%. Most do not own nicer kilts.

[creagdhubh]

Bring forrit the proud swing of the heavyweight tartan!