Government Tartans - Regimentals

[TheBrus]

Because my jonesing is playing up today, I went to New House Highland's website just to daydream for a few minutes. I have a couple of questions that the tartan experts might be able to answer. I read about the regimental tartans that Matt offers, and I see he has arranged them thusly:

Black Watch - Highland No. 1a
Cameron of Erracht - Highland No. 4
Gordon - Highland No. 3
MacKenzie Seaforth - Highland No. 2
Stewart Hunting - Highland No. 8
Stewart Royal - Highland

I'm familiar with the convention of numbering these tartans, and I think I know that Tartan 1a is a slightly brighter variant of Tartan 1, which the Black Watch used to wear (stop me there, if I'm wrong). But there's a gap in the numbering. What happened to tartans 5, 6, and 7? Does Royal Stuart have a number?

Answers will go into my trivia file. Thanks!

The Brus

[Tobus]

This page has a list of the government-numbered tartans towards the bottom: http://www.kellybadge.co.uk/beginner...artanNumbering

Tartan	Names of Tartan	Used by the following Regiments
1	Government Tartan No. 1. Universal. Black Watch	The Black Watch (The Royal Regiment)
1A	Government Tartan No. 1A	Argyll & Sutherland Highlanders
2	MacKenzie	Seaforth Highlanders The Highlanders (Seaforth, Gordons & Camerons) - Trews only
3	Gordon	Gordon Highlanders The Highlanders (Seaforth, Gordons & Camerons) - Kilt only
4	Cameron of Erracht	Queen's Own Cameron Highlanders Queen's Own Highlanders (Seaforth & Cameron) The Highlanders (Seaforth, Gordons & Camerons) - Pipers' Kilts
5A	MacKenzie	Royal Highland Fusiliers Highland Light Infantry
6	Douglas	Cameronians (Scottish Rifles)
7	Leslie	King's Own Scottish Borderers
8	Hunting Stuart	Royal Scots
9	Forbes	Liverpool Scottish
11	Red Erskine	Royal Highland Fusiliers - Pipers only
15	Red Grant	Royal Signals
16	Red MacDuff	Scottish Transport Regiment RLC (V)
18	Red Robertson	225 (Highland) Field Ambulance RAMC/RLC (V)
19	Hunting Fraser	Lovat Scouts
22	MacDonald of the Isles
26	MacDonnell of Keppoch
	Royal Stuart	Scots Guards Royal Scots Pipers
	Hodden Grey	London Scottish
	Hunting Rose	Royal Tank Regiment - Pipers only

[TheBrus]

Awesome! Thanks.

[Tobus]

I should probably point out, before someone else does, that the list may not accurately reflect recent changes in regimental tartans or regimental makeup. But it's still useful for identifying the names that correspond with tartan numbers.

[freddie]

Thanks for this great info. I recently had a replica HLI kilt made in genuine MOD Highland number 5 Mackenzie. However my Father was a Seaforth Highlander, and I asked for the kilt to be made in that style. Of course this should be Highland number 2 tartan. I read somewhere that the difference between the two was sett size, and that you'd need a ruler to tell the difference (so I hope no one notices). However, if it is such a slight difference it makes you wonder why they bothered making two versions of the same tartan. Just to muddy the waters even further I saw an old army kilt on eBay recently where the label stated 'Mackenzie - HLI and Seaforth O.R.' ! Unfortunately there wasn't a photo of the pleats, as the HLI had knife pleats and the Seaforths had box pleats.

[TheBrus]

Another interesting piece of trivia. Thanks, Freddie.
Springboard question: I know about the Gordons, the RHR, and the HLI having knife pleats. Were the rest of the Highland regiments box pleated kilts?

JDB

[freddie]

I know that the Argyll and Sutherland Highlanders were but I don't know of any more.

[Grouse Claw]

Here's my foray into the Government Tartan situation, for what it's worth: My grandfather and great grandfather served in the Argyll and Sutherland Highlanders, were stationed at Dumbarton Castle and Stirling Castle and wore Black Watch, so I was interested in wearing that tartan. Then I read that it had been replaced by Scottish Regiments Government Tartan. So I asked Stirling Castle, the home of the A. & S. H., if the Government Tartan was available to the general public to wear. Some weeks after my query they said they weren't sure, and then later said it was out of supply, except for some scraps. In the meantime I changed my mind and ordered something else. My late mother possessed her father's Black Watch kilt and her grandfather's badger sporran (but they mysteriously disappeared, as treasures do). And now I read that the A & S.H. have ceremonial duties only.

[Mael Coluim]

Since the re-organization of the British Army in 2004, the Royal Regiment of Scotland uses Government tartan 1A which was the tartan of Argyll and Sutherland Highlanders. I think the description used of 1A is that its a brighter color of 1 which was the Government tartan used by the BW.

[rsvpiper]

The Tartan of the RRoS is the Officers and WO's pattern from the Argylls which is brighter blue colour than the Argyll OR's 1A kilt or the Black Watch