Preposterous video and my response

[OC Richard]

I thought of this thread when listening to this video of a fascination discussion about Septimius Severus, which of course touches on his Scottish campaigns at the end of his life.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zSmf7xUJv9Q

There's a telling bit at 24:22

On the other hand, they point out that the Midland Valley of Scotland probably would have been able to produce sufficient crop value to offset the price of Roman occupation, and raise the question "why didn't the Romans annexe that region?"

They bring up an interesting consideration I'd not heard raised before.

We know that prior to the Romans invading Britain there was tremendous trade between Gaul (a Roman province) and Britain, the loss of the tax revenue of which would offset the financial gains the Romans would reap by directly squeezing every bit of worth out of a conquered Britain.

A good part of this trade was vast quantities of fine Roman wine and other Roman luxury goods purchased by British aristocracy (especially in the southeast) which had already been attracted to the Roman way of life to some degree. Thus even before the Roman invasion the process of Romanisation had already begun.

In the north of Britain not so much! The natives continued to dwell in traditional British round-houses while in the south Roman style towns and houses became the norm.

The presenters of that video make the point that with "the people of Caledonia" the Romans didn't have the aid of pre-Romanisation which so often helped the Romans win the hearts and minds of those the Romans were considering annexing.

[Pleater]

The weather might have something to do with it.
Many people fail to realise just how far it is travelling from the south coast of England to the north of Scotland, and the difference in the weather and climate before you even get to Hadrian's wall.

Down here on the coast where I now live there are grapes growing outside, we have outdoor seating in many places, with a roof over as it does rain a bit, but with a few modifications it is possible to live a very Mediterranean lifestyle.

In the Midlands - well - Roman soldiers would probably want to add leggings to their uniforms, and write home asking their mum to send them some vests and thick socks.

Further north still, but still in England, the whole legion would probably be complaining about their feet, the cold and the rain and the wind, and how everything goes rusty, mouldy or just falls apart. They'd probably be volunteering for anything which would give them a reason not to venture further north, such as building a wall.

Another factor could be how slowly trees grow in Scotland, and once cleared woodland doesn't regenerate on its own. That could have made a significant difference to the effort required to construct just about anything.

Anne the Pleater

[OC Richard]

The weather might have something to do with it.
Many people fail to realise just how far it is travelling from the south coast of England to the north of Scotland, and the difference in the weather and climate before you even get to Hadrian's wall.

Down here on the coast where I now live there are grapes growing outside, we have outdoor seating in many places, with a roof over as it does rain a bit, but with a few modifications it is possible to live a very Mediterranean lifestyle.

Don't Devon and Cornwall have the best weather in Britain? My wife and I are addicted to Escape to the Country and Location Location Location and when they've been showing houses on the south coast we've sometimes seen palm trees (which along with bungalows gives a California feel).

In the Midlands - well - Roman soldiers would probably want to add leggings to their uniforms...

Yes Roman uniforms changed drastically from their Mediterranean lightweight short-sleeved tunics and sandals in Germania and Britannia, with breeks borrowed from the Gauls, proper boots, thick socks, heavy British-made cloaks, and so forth.

...and write home asking their mum to send them some vests and thick socks.

They did do, and such letters have been found at Vindolanda.

Further north still, but still in England, the whole legion would probably be complaining about their feet, the cold and the rain and the wind, and how everything goes rusty, mouldy or just falls apart. They'd probably be volunteering for anything which would give them a reason not to venture further north, such as building a wall.

For sure the Italians hated the weather. Though Hadrian's Wall wasn't manned by Roman Legions (the Legionary forts were York, Chester, and Caerleon).

The foreign auxiliary troops who did man the wall were from all over. The German auxiliaries wouldn't have been as put off by the weather, but there were also auxiliaries from warm climes like Syria and Spain for whom it would have seemed hellish.

[grizzbass]

I just now came across this video which perpetuates the entirely false narrative that the Romans "failed to conquer Scotland" and couldn't handle the fierce Caledonian warriors.

I had to set the record straight. Seems like I'm the first to comment, and it's a doozy.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Oi71Aikz3aM

Great response.
I love history and hate when people perpetrate old myths or make up new ones.
This week I was really excited to learn Netflix has doing a 4 episode series on James Garfield "Death by Lightning" as he is a hero of mine. He truly was an incredible man who led an incredible life.
Watching it was enjoyable at first but then they decided his real life wasn't dramatic enough and introduced complete lies about his history.
One of the big frustrations was they said in answer to criticism that they didn't cover important aspects of his life and character was they only had 4 hours and you can't cover everything with that limited time. So instead they wasted at least 30 minutes of the 4 hours introducing two major lies about his story. One his wife Lucretia knew the assassin from a chance meeting and met with him after the assassination and more egregious that his vice president Chester Arthur had gotten to know his assassin and they had a very friendly relationship. There were other much smaller lies but these two wasted the majority of the time they said they didn't have.
The excuse the director said as to why they knowingly created these lies about the life of James Garfield was they had two great actors in Garfield and the assassin and they had to use their talents. The cast was excellent and they did a great job but how does that explain the propaganda they created. They also said that if people liked the series they may go and read about James Garfield and so the lies they created won't do any harm. That convenient lie bothered me quite a bit in an era where most people get their news from facebook and other terrible sources so a series with lies now is the truth to most who saw it.