"ENTITLEMENTS"

[Alan H]

I recently joined Clan MacNaughton.

Now, I have a McKnight in my aancestry, but you know, it's way, 'way back there on my mothers side. The blood connection with the clan is mighty darned thin.

When I joined the clan, I read through the constitution and by-laws. There's an article in there that says that a "broken man"...meaning a man with no land and no clan, can join Clan Macnaughton essentially by paying dues and just joining up. For all practical purposes, that's me, my eight-generations-removed McKnight or not.

Now, honestly, what's the difference between that and some guy from who-knows-where, coming north over the Cheviot Hills, managing to get through the Borders alive, and arriving on the shore of Lock Fyne in 1640? He marries a MacNaughton woman, swears allegiance to the MacNaughtons, and ta-daaa, the guy is a MacNaughton.

All that said, I agree with Cajunscot. Just because someone chooses to wear a "traditional" kilt only to the "traditional" events like weddings, Burns Suppers and Highland Games does not mean we should look down on the guy. When we start thinking "we're better that "HIM" whoever HE is, because we wear kilts more often than HE does, then, well....that's wrong, gentlemen.

[Magnus Sporrano]

I'm not suggesting at all that we look down on the guys that only wear the kilt to formal events.

I am suggesting that we ("we" being those who wear the kilt more regularly, if not daily) not propagate the traditions that were spawned relatively late in kilt history, that serve only to make the kilt a costume or an exclusive garment. The much older traditions, which were forgotten during Proscription, lend themselves better to daily wear and are more inclusive.

[Dreadbelly]

I understand what Magnus is getting at.

I think.

[Alan H]

I'm not suggesting at all that we look down on the guys that only wear the kilt to formal events.

I am suggesting that we ("we" being those who wear the kilt more regularly, if not daily) not propagate the traditions that were spawned relatively late in kilt history, that serve only to make the kilt a costume or an exclusive garment. The much older traditions, which were forgotten during Proscription, lend themselves better to daily wear and are more inclusive.

No worries, mate!

The truth is that there's no reason why both "traditions" can't co-exist just fine, as long as folks who wear the kilt approach it, and each other with a bit of respect and education.

[Andrew Breecher]

I think that respect to the traditions of kilts changes depending on what I'm wearing it for.

I wear the kilt every day, and in the summer I wear it with sandals and a tank top - hey it's pretty comfortable in the heat to wear only two items of clothing! In cooler weather I'll wear kilt hose and flashes, but with sneakers (trainers). When I'm hiking, I don't wear kilt hose, and I'll even wipe the sweat off my face with my kilt. Hey, it's what I wear - it's a kilt, not a flag, I can do what I please.

But when I dress up with a shirt and tie, and a jacket, and shiny black shoes I treat the kilt differently. In fact, it's exactly the same kilt (well, one of them) that I wear every other day, but with a jacket it becomes more formal. When I dress up I tend to wear my Irish county tartan kilt rather than my other tartans, not because it's any nicer, but rather because I have a family connection to that tartan.

Andrew.

[Mike1]

I recently joined Clan MacNaughton.

You know, at the risk of seeming to pick fly "stuff" out of pepper, I am going to insert a bit of a comment here.

Methinks that you mean to say that you recently joined the Clan MacNaughton SOCIETY.

Yeah, it's a minor point, but think about it for a moment.

If you are a MacNaughton, you are a MacNaughton. There's no need to pay dues, no membership cards, etc. If you are a family member, then you are a family member. Do any of us actually charge our family members to be a part of our family and then send them quarterly newsletters?

And, if you are a MacNaughton, then what is to be gained by paying dues?

Which is not to say that the clan societies should not exist, because they do bring families together and help out with family lineage research studies.

I am a member of a clan society for just these very reasons. But the blood that runs through my veins has always been there, dues card or no, OK?

I have blood ties to two families from the Cowal peninsula, one from near Loch Lomond and one from Fife. I am descended from these families. Am I any more a "family member" if I pay dues to the clan societies that bear their names? Or any less?

When I joined the clan, I read through the constitution and by-laws.

How many families have a constitution or by-laws? See my point?

Now, honestly, what's the difference between that and some guy from who-knows-where, coming north over the Cheviot Hills, managing to get through the Borders alive, and arriving on the shore of Lock Fyne in 1640? He marries a MacNaughton woman, swears allegiance to the MacNaughtons, and ta-daaa, the guy is a MacNaughton.

You mean Loch Fyne?

Quite a difference. At one point, afore so many were burned out of their homes and driven off the land to make way for the great, white sheep, a man could marry into a family and both contribute to and benefit from its well-being. And no dues cards present at the dinner table, eh? ;)

[highlander_Daz]

Mike I know in the past we've disagreed on several subjects but this time you are "right on the Money" 100%

[Dreadbelly]

I am a Douglas and I pay nothing. If somebody asked me for dues on being a Douglas...

Well frankly I would respond in typical and true Douglas fashion. I would brain them for being a ninny.

[macwilkin]

I am a Douglas and I pay nothing. If somebody asked me for dues on being a Douglas...

Well frankly I would respond in typical and true Douglas fashion. I would brain them for being a ninny.

Whilst I agree with Mike's sentiments in general, let me just respond to the comment above that there are quite a few clan societies that do a lot of good work with those dues. Besides the aforementioned genealogical research (some of those societies have tons of material gathered in a central location, which allows a large number of folks to share years worth of research), dues also help with upkeep of clan heritage centers, which may be located in a historic church, castle, etc., scholarships, promoton of Scottish heritage & culture, and even charitable activities, as well as social events, newsletters, etc. Many clan societies have the "blessing" of the chief, and the chief & his/her family are active members and support the society's efforts, with some chiefs even travelling across the pond to events like annual general meetings at highland games, etc.

And we need to remember that the first clan society, the Clan Buchanan Society, was started in the early 19th century as a charitable organisation to assist "members" in time of need.

And in general, dues help keep societies alive. As an officer & Past President of our local Scottish Society, as well as an officer in my clan society, I can personally attest that they keep the "the lights on", so to speak.

So, bottom line: whilst you don't need to be a member of the Clan Society to be a (insert Clan name here), one great way to show your support and appreciation for your heritage is to be a member and support the society. It's just another way to "show the colours".

Cheers,

Todd

[Dreadbelly]

I wouldn't mind "donating" to the Douglas cause.

But being required to pay dues to be recognised as a Douglas?

I think not!

We respond to tyranny with extreme action. And holding a name for ransom is just plain wrong.

Make no mistake though. I would have no bones about a donation here and there. There are many noble causes that need support.