Not appropriate for a soldier?

[John M.]

Well, Air Defence Guild is a reservist association, where everyone should wear civilian clothes.

If the kilt "is" what you choose to wear as a civilian, then I say irritate the crap out of em.

[bubba]

And just what is an active duty officer doing telling civilians how to dress? They tell you civilian cress, the kilt IS civilian dress. It appears that particular officer is a nincompoop who doesn't know what he's talking about. I'd make an issue of it over his head.

[bikercelt1]

And just what is an active duty officer doing telling civilians how to dress? .... I'd make an issue of it over his head.

I'm with Bubba. If this anal retentive officer can affect your regular employment then do what he wants in the short run but start finding ways to go around him and reach a more reasonable superior. If he can't affect your regular employment then he has no authority to tell you what you can and can't wear. He obviously is totally out of touch with the reality of masculinity and has some issues of his own to work out. You're not responsible for his issues.

I can't wear my kilt at work except on special occasions. The person who says I can't is the person who pays me, so he does have authority over me. I find my own ways to strike back though. I haven't worn long pants in almost three years. I keep "discovering" more ethnic "holidays" that justify wearing a kilt. I listen to bagpipe music in my office and hang my basket-hilt broadsword on the wall opposite my desk. You're a clever fellow, you'll find ways to express yourself in spite of Officer Anal.

Jamie

[motorman4life]

If you were in the United States, I would say to gather up information on military kilts among US, Canadian and other allies. Put together a portfolio with images, articles, sample tartans and whatever else you can find. In particular, I would get as much information on the official USAF, USN, USCG and US Marine tartans. There is also a Westpoint tartan used by the US Army. Is there any use of the kilt in the Finish military?

If you were in the US, I would saay to get a copy of the US Tartan Day Resolution (Congress) and any applicable resolutions that have been made in the state in which you reside. Get military specifications and details on kilts and kilt outfits for formal military mess and dress attire and put it all together in a packet.

You could still do this, because it does tend to show the kilt is in fact a part of military attire.

Show that packet to him and see what he says. Tell him you want it back, but if he wants to look it all over at his leisure, let him do so. After he does that, ask him if he has changed his mind. If he has not, write a letter or meet with his superior tp explain your situation: the unlawful order, your displeasure with the position, the refusal to resend the order and your appeal for his superior to review the packet and deal with the situation appropriately.

I think once you start doing some reasearch, you will see how much the kilt is a part of the mainstream military and if you can get him to realize that, you will be allowed to wear a kilt.

[AckZel]

Ok, some light to the situation because I think some of you misunderstood me. I am myself an ACTIVE officer, I work in the military. The guild is supported by military but is not an official military institution. It is voluntary work with reservists and other interested. You don't even have to be served in military to join. That what makes it difficult. Can my superiors say what to wear in voluntary association meetings where everyone is expected to wear civilian clothes, not uniforms? And this is only a matter of two small minded majors. Most retired officers (which there is most of members of guild) don't mind what I wear. Most of them said "Brave guy to have balls to wear kilt." I think ordering me wear pants as civilian clothes is restriction of individuals freedom. I have no problem wearing pants as uniform when I'm on duty. They pay me for it! But on freetime in voluntary work?

And cavscout, the reason to encourage to wear civilian clothes in guild meetings is because it is not on duty job. It is voluntary work with reservists and ex-military and only supported by military. It is meant to be casual type of thing.

I think I try the last minute idea. Next time I go in trousers. After the meeting we always go to sauna and take couple of beers. I just change in to kilt after sauna and if they have something to say about it I just answer that "Hey, the meeting is already ending! I'm just leaving!" And maybe I try to join some clan. Then I could show a paper to give me reason to wear it!

[Riverkilt]

Found a European Union tartan, that includes Finland...no clue where to get a kilt from it though. Might be tougher to hassle you over a patriotic kilt.

http://ourworld.compuserve.com/homepages/CChalmers/

Also have read that Finland has a history of bagpipes too...a long reach to kilts though.

Listen to your heart, you'll know what to do.

Ron

[AckZel]

Found a European Union tartan, that includes Finland...no clue where to get a kilt from it though. Might be tougher to hassle you over a patriotic kilt.

Well, when we get the Finnish Kilt Association (thinking of name) working, we are going to register a tartan for the association. We were thinking about "Bravehearts Finland Ry" (If you got ideas, please share em', Ry = Registered Association). It will have founding conference 30th Nov (St Andrews day!)

And EU tartan is found in the Kilt Store. Looks very good too. There is also "European" tartan.

[KiltedHuntsman]

When you're in the Military, they own you. You represent the military on or off duty. If your Commanding Officer thinks the kilt is not appropriate, that it does not properly represent your unit, then that's it, no kilt. Fact of life. Main reason I never joined. They own you.

It's also why I have such tremendous respect for the people who serve in the military. They make an enormous sacrifice of their freedom when they join. They make that sacifice for me, so that I can live my life as I choose. For a military unit to be effective, to be credible, they must be serious about what they do. All members obeying orders makes them an effective fighting unit. Makes them credible enough to be an actual deterrent. If a military unit organization is seen as powerful and something not to be messed with, nobody starts a fight with them, and thus nobody dies.

It's a tough life in the military, even if you don't get to fight. Our service personnel are not paid nearly enough for all the sacrifices they make.

I work for the military as a Civil Servant. I see up close and personal what military personnel must deal with. I've also served in the Air Force Auxiliary (Civil Air Patrol), worn the uniform, and had to deal with the fact that when I'm in public in uniform, I represent ALL the people who wear the same uniform. It's a burden. I even served as Commandant of Cadets. Me, a paragon of Military Virtue. Yikes!

So, yet another sacrifice for you. Bear it well.

[AckZel]

It's not that radical, you know. I am a 2nd Ltn and when I end the work, I'm off duty and that is my own decision what I wear. They actually don't have any rights to say what to wear off duty. They can try but it is not right. Might be different in the states. Most officers change civilian clothes at the garrison before they leave home. (And I really think most of them wears much more untidy clothes than me... but hey, trousers are a common OK!)

[Graham]

Well, I guess this will sound unsympathetic, but anyone in the military, police etc. is in an organisation whereby one has to live under an authority.

Personally, I will not do that. I'll not have my freedom, beliefs or conscience compromised or dictated by other men claiming authority over my life.

So if you're in such an organisation, I guess you'll have to comply, if you don't like it - leave, I am fairly sure you'll not change the system.