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16th August 06, 03:01 PM
#1
Colin, I truly enjoyed your response to my post! I've noticed the "American phenomenon" as well ... I've been giving it alot of thought.
It seems to me that part of what both broadens the kilted community and sometimes divides it is the way Americans take the best parts of what any given immigrant heritage brings with it, tayloring it a bit and then calling it American. All one needs to do is look at what we Americans call "Mexcan Food," or "French Fries," or "Chinese Food," all which have been "Americanized" to appeal to a broader and broader spectrum of people. I'm not even certain that French Fries were ever French at all.
The U.S. has been called the 'Great Melting Pot' ... trouble is that when something gets melted it loses some of its original form. The loss of the original form can be disconcerting to those who held it or hold it dear. And in the melting cultural distinctions blur and some things actually become cross cultured ... The entire classic Texan Outfit is a perfect example. The Texas Outfit is made up entirely of bastardized parts of at least 3 different cultures and exists nowhere else outside the American mid-West. There is no similar outfit in any of the donor cultures, only similar parts of it.
Kilts. Kilts are no different and as more and more kilts are worn and made in America some of what makes for a traditional kilt will be lost and some of what makes up a dozen other forms of cultural clothing will slowly be merged into it or added to it as an accessory. As this process unfolds and more and more men of little or no Scottish descent or heritage start to wear kilts then the kilt itself becomes American and wearing a kilt for reasons of heritage becomes less and less common among kilted men.
If heritage declines as a reason to wear a kilt then some other reason will replace it. In a society bent on keeping men in pants it is a rare kiltman who is not forarmed with reasons for why he is wearing one. Frankly, here in America, simply claiming Scottish descent as the culture of America melts all things Scottish more and more into the cultural whole will become a peculiar and rare reason. I'm guessing this evolution of kilting from Scottish to American will not go entirely without a fight from those who continue to hold firm to heritage as their primary reason for kilting.
It's very possible that I don't know what I'm talking about ... it's just as possible that I do. No matter what reason any particular man gives for wearing his kilts I will applaud him. As for any American wearing a kilt outside of reasons of Scottish Pride and Heritage I must wholey agree with Colin that they really do owe a 'thank you' to those brave enough to have opened a societal door just wide enough for any kilted man who wants to to walk through it. Scots did not do this, Scottish Heritage Groups did not do this ... these groups largely provided only an excuse to wear a kilt, "Oh, your Scottish, I guess it's cool." I'm Scots-Irish-American Indian, so I can just get away with it ... my son is Scots-Irish-American Indian-German-French, who knows what broadening mix of descents his children will have. If they wear kilts it will not likely be for reasons of Scottish heritage or pride.
It is the man who puts on his kilt and goes to Walmart for no particular reason that get's credit for broadening the spectrum of kiltwearers. He's not celebrating his heritage, not attending a Ren. Fair, not participating in a Holiday .... no, he's wearing it for Freedoms' sake. He's wearing it because he wants to and nobody can stop him. This kind of man will wear his kilt to work and open the door for others 'not of Scottish descent' to wear it there as well. Those who are privilaged enough to claim Scottish descent owe no thanks to this man, but for the increasing numbers of those who cannot stake such a claim then let Freedom be the reason they ....
Kilt On.
Chris Webb
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16th August 06, 06:47 PM
#2
Kilts. Kilts are no different and as more and more kilts are worn and made in America some of what makes for a traditional kilt will be lost and some of what makes up a dozen other forms of cultural clothing will slowly be merged into it or added to it as an accessory. As this process unfolds and more and more men of little or no Scottish descent or heritage start to wear kilts then the kilt itself becomes American and wearing a kilt for reasons of heritage becomes less and less common among kilted men.
If heritage declines as a reason to wear a kilt then some other reason will replace it. In a society bent on keeping men in pants it is a rare kiltman who is not forarmed with reasons for why he is wearing one. Frankly, here in America, simply claiming Scottish descent as the culture of America melts all things Scottish more and more into the cultural whole will become a peculiar and rare reason. I'm guessing this evolution of kilting from Scottish to American will not go entirely without a fight from those who continue to hold firm to heritage as their primary reason for kilting.
It's very possible that I don't know what I'm talking about ... it's just as possible that I do. No matter what reason any particular man gives for wearing his kilts I will applaud him. As for any American wearing a kilt outside of reasons of Scottish Pride and Heritage I must wholey agree with Colin that they really do owe a 'thank you' to those brave enough to have opened a societal door just wide enough for any kilted man who wants to to walk through it. Scots did not do this, Scottish Heritage Groups did not do this ... these groups largely provided only an excuse to wear a kilt, "Oh, your Scottish, I guess it's cool." I'm Scots-Irish-American Indian, so I can just get away with it ... my son is Scots-Irish-American Indian-German-French, who knows what broadening mix of descents his children will have. If they wear kilts it will not likely be for reasons of Scottish heritage or pride.
I beg your pardon; Scots and Scottish heritage groups most certainly did do something in helping introduce the general public to Highland attire; In the 19th century, the Highland Games introduced many non-Scots to Scottish culture, and the kilt came right along with it. Not to mention all of the St. Andrew's Societies, who held St. Andrew's Day and Burns Night services, suppers and balls. So please don't dismiss their contributions. They keep alive the story of the Scottish and Ulster-Scottish immigrant who came to these shores and made a contribution to their new country. As President Woodrow Wilson said, "Every line of strength in American history is colored with Scottish blood."
And as far as heritage goes, remember that your ideas are nothing new; the whole concept of American state and Canadian provincial tartans allows for anyone to wear that tartan, regardless of ethnic background. Many of these "non-Scots" still hold fast to traditional Highland attire, whilst wearing a tartan designed to be inclusive of all residents of a particular area. Even other ethnic groups, like the Italians, the Dutch, the Norwegians, etc. are adopting tartans and highlighting, not casting off, the connections between Scotland and their countries and people. Believe what you want to, Chris, but the kilt will not lose its Scottish roots and heritage, no matter how much you wish it.
He's not celebrating his heritage, not attending a Ren. Fair, not participating in a Holiday .... no, he's wearing it for Freedoms' sake. He's wearing it because he wants to and nobody can stop him. This kind of man will wear his kilt to work and open the door for others 'not of Scottish descent' to wear it there as well. Those who are privilaged enough to claim Scottish descent owe no thanks to this man, but for the increasing numbers of those who cannot stake such a claim then let Freedom be the reason they ....
Interesting...so I am less of a kiltwearer in your eyes because I do wear my kilt as a symbol of my heritage to Burns Suppers, St. Andrew's Society functions and educational programs that I present to local schools, etc.?
Todd
Last edited by macwilkin; 16th August 06 at 07:37 PM.
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17th August 06, 05:39 AM
#3
 Originally Posted by cajunscot
Believe what you want to, Chris, but the kilt will not lose its Scottish roots and heritage, no matter how much you wish it.
Todd
Todd, I agree. Case in point: Yesterday I wore a Utilikilt Heather Grey Mocker, white polo, grey crew socks, and white sneakers. I was asked several times if I was Scottish. I've had the same thing happen wearing an Amerikilt.
Now, I also wear traditional wool tartans as well. But I think whether a kilt is a non-traditional or a traditional, the public will still make that association with Scotland. That's certainly ok with me - thanks to the Scots I enjoy wearing a variety of these wonderful garments. And when I wear my Ireland's National or Irish American tartans I wear them with great pride in my heritage.
Darrell
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16th August 06, 09:32 PM
#4
 Originally Posted by Chris Webb
It is the man who puts on his kilt and goes to Walmart for no particular reason that get's credit for broadening the spectrum of kiltwearers. He's not celebrating his heritage, not attending a Ren. Fair, not participating in a Holiday .... no, he's wearing it for Freedoms' sake. He's wearing it because he wants to and nobody can stop him.
Oh....that's me! I wore my Utilikilt to PetCo tonight just because I thought it would be fun! 
It was fun! Life is too short not to have fun!
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16th August 06, 11:33 PM
#5
Wearing a kilt should not be seen as freedom as there is no law in our society that forbid men from wearing the kilt. I don't feel that I am more free by putting on a kilt because I don't know what I am freed from.
In order to feel free, a man needs to feel trapped by the society first. I have never felt like I am trapped. I don't feel that I am trapped that I have to wear a business suit for work. I feel good, comfortable and successful when I am in my suit. I bet either Colin or Todd feel like they are 'free men' when they wore their kilts.
Wearing the kilt should not be about freedom. Men do not need any reason to wear the kilt, except for the inspiration to wear it. We do not need to make up any excuse. I got the idea of wearing the kilt when I was a young boy, and I wasn't try to be free or different. I wanted to wear the kilt because I used to see them all the time during special ceremonies in Hong Kong. It was the Blackwatch and the Royal Scots who inspired me to wear the kilt.
If you want to feel free or brave, go wear a woman skirt.
Last edited by Raphael; 16th August 06 at 11:52 PM.
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17th August 06, 12:44 AM
#6
Oh, the 'S' word ...
There must be a consensus somewhere. Lots of us enjoy a sense of occasion, and that's one thing a kilt can give you. Lots of us wear the kilt casually, and that's what this forum's about. Nobody here has a problem with full-time kilt-wearers. And I can't be the only one here who finds the notion of being tyrannised by trousers a little odd...
Anyone in a kilt is fine by me, whether they wear it once in a lifetime or every day.
Cheers
M.
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17th August 06, 03:04 AM
#7
 Originally Posted by Chris Webb
I'm not even certain that French Fries were ever French at all.
French Fries is Belgian.
 Originally Posted by Chris Webb
Kilts are no different and as more and more kilts are worn and made in America some of what makes for a traditional kilt will be lost and some of what makes up a dozen other forms of cultural clothing will slowly be merged into it or added to it as an accessory. As this process unfolds and more and more men of little or no Scottish descent or heritage start to wear kilts then the kilt itself becomes American and wearing a kilt for reasons of heritage becomes less and less common among kilted men.
It will be a sad day if people no longer associate the kilt with Scotland and see it as an American way of life.
 Originally Posted by Chris Webb
It is the man who puts on his kilt and goes to Walmart for no particular reason that get's credit for broadening the spectrum of kiltwearers. He's not celebrating his heritage, not attending a Ren. Fair, not participating in a Holiday .... no, he's wearing it for Freedoms' sake. He's wearing it because he wants to and nobody can stop him. This kind of man will wear his kilt to work and open the door for others 'not of Scottish descent' to wear it there as well. Those who are privilaged enough to claim Scottish descent owe no thanks to this man, but for the increasing numbers of those who cannot stake such a claim then let Freedom be the reason they ....
Do you think that you are better than us because we don't wear our kilts to work?
I don't wear my kilt for freedom sake or try to open the door for others 'not of Scottish Descent' to wear it. I don't wear mine for work because I don't see a point to it. I also don't wear it for comfort reason either. And yes, I have worn mine for Burns Suppers, Highland Games and participated in a St. Patrick's day parade.
I know a few full time kilt wearers in Vancouver, and they don't really care whether other people follow their footsteps at all. They wear the kilt for themselves and not for other people. They are not actively advocating that men should burn their pants and switch to the kilt 24/7.
I have said it before and I will say it again: there are times for kilts and there are times for pants/trousers/shorts/capri.
And do me a favour, please don't try to convince me that the kilt is perfect for bike riding, scuba diving, climbing, yoga, swimming, sky diving, rugby, soccer, hockey or bungee jumping.
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17th August 06, 03:57 AM
#8
I truly feel that the fellows that are the most concerned about other fellows not wearing their kilts full-time are the ones that are worried about standing out in the crowd. If you're one kiltie in a room, you're going to come under scrutiny. If you are one of ten kilties in a room, then you don't bear the scrutiny alone.
I think Chris' ideas about kilts being 'melted down' into an Americanized garment is more wishful thinking than anything else. And his example of 'Texas Wear' fully supports my theory. Scots were wearing kilts in this country long before Texas and its 'Wear' came into the picture. If 'Texan Wear' has been bastardized in so short a period of time, how has the traditional Scots kilt managed to survive?
Sure, you're going to have fad cultures pick up the kilt, but fads come and fads go. I was one of the non-conformists of the 60's that had tie-dyed shirts, bell-bottom jeans, hair half-way down my back and a surplus jacket. We non-conformists were easy to spot, because we had all conformed to one another. That style went away, shortly thereafter.
The difference is that I was of Scots descent then, just as surely as I am now. The heart is Highland, not a fad.
There are a considerable handful of full-time kilties on this forum that rarely mention that fact about themselves. Then there are others that celebrate the weekly anniversaries of their decision to be kilted full-time. Some things are important to some people and mean little to nothing to others. The important aspect of it all is that we all have the freedom (note: lower case 'f') to make our own decisions and to select whatever it is we choose to wear.
For those kilties that go on and on about 'Freedom', I wonder if you wear shoes. Have you never experienced how 'Free' you can be without footwear?
I'm sitting here typing this in a pair of jeans that are as comfortable as an old friend. No binding whatsoever, I bought them to fit, not to be enslaved by a fad style. And since sitting down, I've not had a single concern about a wrinkled pleat. When I leave for the salt mine, there'll be no issue about the closure device on a sporran, or whether my hand fits into my sporran well - my keys are in my pocket. At no point during the day am I going to have to worry about accidentally answering The Question for customers or co-workers and I fully trust that none will ask The Question. I'm afraid there'll be no pictures of me wearing today's jeans, but you'll have to live with that. I don't know if it is windy outside or not, but it is a non-issue, because even a hurricane couldn't blow the hems of my pant legs up enough to embarrass anyone.
Now if you've chosen to wear a kilt today, I say good on you and wear it well.
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17th August 06, 04:13 AM
#9
Obviously kilts will always be associated with Scotland. But the phenomenon I've described is indeed taking place ... if it wasn't then none of us would be wearing our kilts in anything but the Scottish way.
Even folks here who hold dear the traditions of Scotland and all that makes the hertitage of Scotland so rich are becoming more and more willing to strap on a non-tradtional kilt and wear it in non-traditional ways. Not all, of course, but more and more.
Flag kilts, rainbow kilts, even in England the traditions are slowly giving way to modern uses and trends. Ham's photo album is the best evidence I can offer as to the increasing variations of acceptable kilts and kilt outfits, and this is in England, which has become a bit of a Melting Pot as well. Is this a bad thing? It really doesn't matter, no amount of disagreement will stop it. I wish we could all be more like Hamish, myself included ... he's the most balanced man among us.
I never said that any kiltman was better than any other (except maybe Ham, LOL)... and I appreciate the Scottish roots of kilts and acknowledge that kilts were introduced to America by Scotsmen and members of Scottish Heritage Groups. I only contend that once that introduction was made that a relatively small number of Americans, with their steady blending of many heritages and traditions, immediately began to make the kilt their own, often against the grain of the rest of American society.
Someone said my ideas are not new, they were right, they're not. I learned about the 'American Melting Pot' in Junior High School. If you don't believe me regarding the direction kilts are going you only need to look up 'kilt' in Wikepedia (sp?). There will always be a select few who will celebrate the specifics of the Scottish kilt tradition, thankfully. I have already said that this phenomenon can be disconcerting to some folks, as evidenced but the reaction to my post ... whether one adheres to tradition or simply wears kilts because they want to I can only say that I am happy that they all ....
Kilt On.
Chris Webb
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17th August 06, 06:50 AM
#10
 Originally Posted by Chris Webb
I wish we could all be more like Hamish, myself included ... he's the most balanced man among us.
Oh, OK, now I get the thrust of your theory. I had completely missed it until now.
Those of us that wear a single tartan because of its significance to our heritage are un-balanced. (Hey, Todd, you be un-balanced and I'll be un-hinged, does that sound fair? )
I only contend that once that introduction was made that a relatively small number of Americans, with their steady blending of many heritages and traditions, immediately began to make the kilt their own, often against the grain of the rest of American society.
Like penny-loafers?
Like double-breasted suits?
Like tie-dye shirts?
Like bell-bottom jeans?
All of which have come and gone, only to come back again. And look at all the plain, white t-shirts that are still being sold and worn. And all the straight leg jeans. Fads come, fads go and fads don't add up to tradition.
If you don't believe me regarding the direction kilts are going you only need to look up 'kilt' in Wikepedia (sp?).
Now THERE'S a reliable source of information to base a theory on. You are aware that any 'authority' can edit Wiki articles?
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