Uh-oh

[Brian F]

Yours looks great. Am I seeing a full pleat on the fron of your hips? Or do all your pleats end on your rear?

My start the the under-apron and end at the over-apron. So I have two sections of flat fabric, with 39 some odd inches of pleats. (If I remember correctly. That kilt got left at my ex-fiance's house...yeah...let's not go there...)

[BEEDEE]

PM AlanH if you can't work it out. He's the originator of the instructions.

Brian

[Alan H]

Ok, lets simplify this. You have to be able to see the kilt in your mind before you can sew it.

To super-simplify, the layout of a kilt is like this...

Your backside, meaning your butt, is covered in pleats. The default size for the box-pleats in an X-Kilt is three inches. OK Irishmans waist is 37 and his rump is 40. So if he were to make a traditionally styled box-pleat kilt, he would make it such that he'd cover one-half of 40 inches, in pleats. That's 20 inches.

OK, so 20 inches divided by three inches is seven, yes, with an extra inch? So If he were making an X-Kilt with a full-width apron, he'd have seven, three inche box pleats that would add up to 21 inches. By subtracting 21 inches from his rump measurement of 40 inches, that gives us an apron width (at the rump...ergo the fell line) of 19 inches.

21 + 19 = 40

However, because the original instructions suggest making an apron that is somewh narrower than a half-rump width "traditional" apron, in fact I would suggest that Irishman make NINE, three inch pleats. That would bring the pleated part of the X-Kilt around his hips part-way, which was my intention. OK, let's work out those numbers...

9 x 3 = 27

So that would mean that 27 inches of those 40 inches of Irishmans hip measurment is taken up in pleats, right? OK, so then how much will be accounted for by the over-apron?

40 - 27 = 13

So I would make a 13 inch-wide over-apron. That's 13 inches wide at the fell, right?

[Alan H]

Um.....I just tried to make a quick fit on my X-Kilt. Did my pleats, attempting to figure out the under apron pleat and decided to wrap it around me to see how the box pleats fell.....THEY COMPLETEY GO AROUND ME!!!! My waist is 37 my rump is 40, the guide says 10 3" pleats and a 16" under, 10" over and 12" under/over apron. That wraps around me twice......am I missing something? PLEASE HELP!!!!

Mate, the measurments must be adjusted for YOUR body size. You can't just go to the appendix and copy out what I put there. Those measurements are for someone else.

Do the mate, my friend! You have a 40-inch rump.

You just made 10, 3 inch wide pleats. OK, so that's 30 inches, of those 40. You now have made a 10 inch over-apron....total, 40 inches. GREAT!

Your under-apron is 16 inches, so you will have lots of overlap....your under-apron will extend far to your left for modesty. Excellent.

Now...what's the twelve-inch under/over apron thing you write about? 'tain't no such thing. Have you gotten yourself an extra foot of material in there?

Look at it this way. forget the under/over thingamabob. Wrap the thing around you. Make sure the under apron is UNDER the over-apron. The far right edge of the over-apron, which you have probably folded over and hemmed/stitched down, should be within an inch of the edge of the last pleat. If it is, you done good. If not, then back to the drawing board.

Now take the thing off , and forget under-this and over-that and whatever the lingo is. You want the cloth thats underneath the over-apron to have enough overlap that you have some modesty. OK, so pick a point that looks good to You. Be generous. Cut the thing off and hem it and put the velcro and the waistband on, and you're good to go.

BTW, writing all this stuff out sometimes gets to be hard. Pictures will help.

[Alan H]

It just occurred to me....

I don't suppose that you've not actually folded up the under-apron pleat? This is the big pleat that goes under the over-apron?

Mate, the left hand edge of the over-apron has to lie right next to the edge of box pleat #1. If you don't do that, if you don't pull them together, you'll have, like 6-12 inches of extra material and there'll be this big space of unpleated fabric between your over-apron and the first box pleat...NOT...

Have you ever seen a traditional kilt? If not, get a look at one to get the basic idea of how a kilt is made, in your head.

[irishman]

That is what I am talking about. The pleat between the over apron and the 1st box pleat. How wide should that be? I am sorry I am confusing everyone I know but I really am a novice. And you are the pro's. Thank you all again.

[alhrensblade]

Irishman,

I had the same problem when making my first X-Kilt. Essentially, the fabric between the edge of pleat #1 and the over apron becomes a huge "under-pleat", just the same way you pleated the 5 1/4" sections of the box pleats- the exception being the measurements, this thing is DEEP and if you just fold it so that it's smooth and flat you should be alright. The way it should end up is with the edge of the over-apron butted up against the edge of the outside of pleat #1. The 3" section next to pleat #1 in the X-Kilt diagram is also part of this under-pleat.
Here's a quick diagram.



(I've just realized that this diagram is technically a view of the "bottom" edge, just think of it mirrored for the waist edge)

[irishman]

Thank you. And i sew it down the edge the same way as the 3" box pleats, correct?

[irishman]

Why is there sooo much material for the under apron pleat?

[fluter]

Hi Irishman,

Step One: don't panic. You're doing great. It pays to read Alan H's document carefully, then study it over and over and ... Also on the other thread, F-H.(B.)C.A.G posted links to 3 of her incredibly informative photo-descriptions. Study those, too. Read Tartan Hiker's description of his method, in Appendix 3, and compare with Alan's text.

If the "over"s and "under"s start to run together, take a deep breath/cup of tea/walk and recall Step One. Next version, let's include that on the title page. Most of us who have tried this have been wearing kilts for a while, or at least looking at them. There are a bunch of details, but you'll sort them out. Just to keep it interesting, there are many ways to build a kilt, and most folks will branch out with little variations after the first essay. Most of us have also had success on our own terms. Remember, my X-kilt Mark I was the first garment I've ever made from scratch!

So far my diagnosis is that yes, you have not made the large pleat under the over-apron. No worries. Go ahead and wrap it around you, see how the pleats lie. Pin it together in front. You're half-way home! Let's recapitulate a bit:

You and I are close to the same size as the Appendix-1 hypothetical fellow. My X-kilt Mark I has the same 10 box-pleats. That leaves 10 inches to cover at our fell line, that's the size of the over-apron.

The extra 12 inches in the Appendix A diagram "under apron pleat" is the aforementioned large pleat: that's what alhrensblade just drew, up-thread---great job, that was most helpful. If we ignored that 12 inches, and the 3-inch hem allowance at the end of the over-apron, and the entire under-apron, we'd have our 40 inch circumference.

Here's mine again. Front of the kilt---please excuse wrinkles and stains, it's about to go into the wash.


Here's how it goes on. The right-hand or "under" apron wraps around me, the left hand or "over" apron goes on top, overlapping it. That's why I said if we ignored the under-apron, we should see something like a kilt. The Velcro patches mostly hold it up, but they could stand to be a bit bigger. The ones on the under-apron could also be longer than the top ones, to allow for a little adjustment.


On the left side of the over-apron (the wearer's left), I have folded that 12 inches (minus my A-shaping of 1.5 inches at the "X") into the large pleat. Actually it looks as though I short-changed that 12 inches somehow, but it would be good to have it. Note also that my "first pleat" adjacent to the large pleat does not have the deeper first fold which alhrensblade drew above. Do it his way, if you have fabric available; if not, it's not a deal-breaker.


On the right side of the under-apron, I made a corresponding pleat, quite a big one. This helps freedom of movement, and helps the aprons to sag between the thighs when I sit down.



I gather that Alan did not put that reverse-pleat in the X-kilt prototypes he was describing. He did make whopping big under-aprons, however! I was partly compensating for the narrow 10-inch under-apron.

If you have some extra fabric on both ends, consider making those 2 pleats as big as possible. I think from Tartan Hiker's brief description that he makes a biggish reverse pleat at the under-apron, using whatever fabric is available. And oh yes: the conventional wisdom seems to be to make the under-apron half again as big as the over-apron, in a kilt like this.