Family Name and Clan

[gilmore]

...I felt kind of limited in my choices at first but I've just gotten used to it. I think for me It's very important for me to be totally honest about who I am no matter if I feel somewhat out of place sometimes on this forum or at the games.

I can respect that it's important for you to be honest about who you are. It's refreshing.

You may find it's better to be limited in choices than to have so many that you wind up spending every penny of spare cash you can get your hands on on tartan that you may have some tenuous connection with.

There are many universal and fashion tartans that I am sure you could wear and feel fine about.

[Ryan Nielson]

You may find it's better to be limited in choices than to have so many that you wind up spending every penny of spare cash you can get your hands on on tartan that you may have some tenuous connection with.

Funny. That is so true too. I need to just get a nice blackwatch kilt and be done with it.

[macwilkin]

Funny. That is so true too. I need to just get a nice blackwatch kilt and be done with it.

Just make sure to spell it "Black Watch" (two words). :mrgreen:*

*Sorry to be nit-picky.

T.

[Raptor]

I also personally will only wear a tartan I have a blood connection to. However,(just to play "devil's advocate") how about where a clan ends up septs of various other clans? For example: my Muir blood is directly from a sept of Gordon. No problem there for me, (especially as two other families in my bloodline are also Gordon), but the Clan Muir fragmented & became septs of Gordon, Campbell, Stuart, & Donald. Does that increase a Muir's options or confuse the issue further?

[macneighill]

I know I'm a little late on this one but . .

Sorry for being out of the net for so long. My motorcycle and I were run down by another vehicle on January 31. It's taken me a while to recooperate.

First of all, glad to hear you are OK.

I for one, believe it is important (at least for myself) that I have some justifiable basis for wearing a particular tartan.

If I'm correct and if my ancestry possesses the family name that matches a sept or a clan, I submit I'm empowered to wear the tartan of that clan. I understand this to be true from the Clan Chief's web site and believe I can safetly say that several if not many others on this site agree.

Is there some flaw in my assumption?

Personally, I feel the same as yourself and many others. There are tartans out there that, I really like. And, I know there are no "real rules" limiting who can or who cannot wear tartans (with a few exceptions). But "ME" personally, I feel if I have no connections to that particular Clan and tartan, then I have no reason to really wear it. If others feel that they want to buy a specific tartan because they like the color . . more power to them. But, not me.

And at the same time, if your name is that of a Sept, then "historically", you have the option of wearing that particular tartan. If you want a more definitive answer as to linking yourself to a clan . . do some research and trace your line back to that Clan or, any others that your family may be associated with.

Some surnames are easier than others to research. Take mine for example: "Nelson" is the 39th most common surname in the USA (out of 88,000 surnames) and, the 387th most common in the UK (out of 270,000 surnames). Our surname was changed during the mid 1700's, from "Neilson" to "Nelson". So, whom ever were recording the names of immigrants as they stepped off of the boat, spelled the name however it sounded to them. For 20 some odd years, my family had hit a wall and were unable to find any info past my GGG Grandfather. Well, he carried the "Nelson" name. Come to find out, his father, carried the name "Neilson". Now, we are told that our family line goes back to Ancient Ireland (we're trying to find some kind of a link). In Scotland, they lived in and around Argyll and Bute.

However, "historically" (as Ryan stated), the "Nelson/Neilson/Nielson" name is associated with 3 clans . . MacNeil, MacKay and Gunn (a few more through the Proscription Act, marriages, etc.). My particular line, is with MacNeil. For so many years, we were unsure . . now we know .

Since then through research, I've discovered that the Gaelic form of Gray is MacGashan. MacGashan is a Sept of the Clan Stewart - Stewarts of Atholl. These Stewarts are a branch of the Royal Stewarts.

Well, my family lived in and around Argyll and Bute, from early times. During King James V's reign, they (my family) were the hereditary Lords of Bute. At some point (we are still unsure); they married into the Stuart/Stewart house (Stuart of Bute). So, does that mean, my family, or myself cannot wear the Stewart tartan, since I do not carry the Stuart/Stewart name??

[IrishGary]

All my best regarding your recovery-- i laid a 'cycle down once in a much less serious way, and still it unnerved me. I quit driving one when i almost had my finale, and all the defensive driving in the world wouldn't have saved me: just very lucky.
I agree with the opinion, just for me, that i prefer a tie to a clan in order to wear their tartan. The universals are all right, but being of the Turnbull persuasion, I prefer that tartan.

[sirdaniel1975]

I really like "Gilmore's" comments in this thread. I have been doing research on my family genealogy for about 10 years now. I spent most of that time gathering information and evidence from my family alone. The past year I dove head first into heavy research.

I have disproved many things my family has previously thought and that I was told when I was a teenager. I have discovered that my family "Williamson's" in no way had any tie to clan Gunn. However there is another family line that was from Caithness Scotland (Gunn Territory) that has some marriages to some Gunn's. I have no problem wearing that tartan.

As a result of my research, I have come up with some pretty solid connections to other clans with other names in my families genealogy. Some of which are: Sutherland, Buchanan, Dunlop, Forbes, Gordon, and Stewart. Most of the areas my family has genetic ties to are Aberdeen, Caithness, Glasgow (Lanark), and Kildonan (Sutherland).

When you do the research, your findings will always be way more interesting than just going with the popular routine.

example: My Williamson ancestors From Glasgow were potters, and I have recently learned through contacting the Scottish Pottery Society that they owned and operated "Wellington Pottery" in Glasgow during the 19th century. According to the Pottery society, Wellington pottery is very rare and they have very few pieces. They were members of the Barony parish during the time of famous minister Norman McLeod's time as the minister of that parish. They also met at Glasgow Cathedral before the Barony Kirk was built. I have also learned that some of my ancestors were members of the Scottish Rite. Not to mention that my Great great grandfather was in the Royal Scots Greys during the Crimean War.

This is solid information, not the: well my surname is on the sept list of clan "blah blah blah."

[macneighill]

When you do the research, your findings will always be way more interesting than just going with the popular routine.

Agreed! When I first became enthralled with tracing my family line, I went on pretty much the "norm". We kept hearing "you're a Nelson so, you can belong to several clans".

Well, this wasn't good enough for me. I wanted specifics, plain and simple. It has taken us 20 some years to get to where we are today. That's why I'm proud of my line. The more I became "involved" with learning my family's history and, the further back we had gone . . the more interesting it became.

[Morris at Heathfield]

If I'm correct and if my ancestry possesses the family name that matches a sept or a clan, I submit I'm empowered to wear the tartan of that clan. I understand this to be true from the Clan Chief's web site and believe I can safetly say that several if not many others on this site agree.

Is there some flaw in my assumption?

If the clan chief you are referring to has stated that all who bear the surname X, or are descended from someone who bore the surname X, are entitled to wear the clan tartan, then I would have to agree with your argument.

However, if your desire is to show your loyalty to the clan, then you may wish to receive clarification on that point. Different clans have different policies regarding sept names. Clan Donald, for instance, places a heavy emphasis on geography: If your surname is M(a)cCrory and your ancestors came from the West Highlands and Islands of Scotland, or from County Antrim in Ireland, welcome to the clan! If your surname is M(a)cCrory and your ancestors came from County Derry, tough luck! (Fortunately, or unfortunately, my McCrory ancestors were from Antrim. )

If you really don't care what the recognized chief of the clan thinks, and just want to express respect for your ancestors who bore a particular surname, I think that's fine too. But, in that case, I'd suggest you do some genealogical research to find out who your ancestors actually were. According to some sources my surname is on the sept lists of the Buchanan and Gordon clans. However, from genealogical research, I think it is a reasonable assumption that none of my paternal ancestors ever set foot north of the Tyne. So, it would be a rather strange way of honoring them by wearing the Buchanan or Gordon tartans.

If you just like the tartan and wish to wear it for that reason, and if the first paragraph in my comment is not entirely true, then I'd suggest you decide if that's reason enough for you. I think "because I like the way it looks" is a stronger reason than a very tenuous link based on surname alone.

[meinfs]

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