What does this mean?

[Aldisimo]

See http://www.xmarksthescot.com/forum/t...546/index.html.

[ardchoille]

See http://www.xmarksthescot.com/forum/t...546/index.html.

I did, but didn't understand it.

[Bugbear]

I did, but didn't understand it.

ardchoille, did you look at this one?

DWFII's thread "what am I seeing here?"

You know who's post to look for; it's the sixth post down.

[ardchoille]

ardchoille, did you look at this one?

DWFII's thread "what am I seeing here?"

You know who's post to look for; it's the sixth post down.

Aha! Thank you Ted, this is very educational. This is also a good explanation of tuck in selvage:

Basically in a typical closed kilting selvedge, each thread is wrapped back around in the weaving and the thread is only cut when you are done with that color. So in terms of the Black Watch tartan pictured, each green section of the tartan is woven with one continuous green thread. Then you switch to black, blue, etc.

With the newer rapier looms each thread is cut and then tucked back up 1/2" or so into the fabric. So you still have a closed selvedge suitable for kilting, but the the bottom 1/2" of the cloth will be a bit thicker, and in the heavy weight cloths especially, this is more noticable. The better mills, such as Lochcarron, take great care in the way the tartan is laid out so that this difference in thickness will correspond with a line in the tartan that "masks" the difference visually. I've seen cloth where this has not been done well (for instance, search the archives for some of the feedback on past runs of the X Marks tartan from Fraser & Kirkbright).

This type of selvedge is becoming more and more common in the tartan industry as older looms break down, and are being replaced with rapier looms.

And as a final note, one side of the fabric will typically be "cleaner" than the other in terms of how the type of selvedge looks. It is important that the kiltmaker use the good face of the cloth for the outside of the kilt. I would guess that the picture in the first post is the "bad" side of the fabric, so hopefully this was on the inside of the kilt.

M

It is my opinion that the tuck-in selvedge looks better than the traditional closed selvedge.

I really enjoy reading posts by the kiltmakers

[Barb T]

There is nothing that looks better than a traditional closed selvedge. You can't see the selvedge, and you can't feel it. The fabric is absolutely perfect all the way to the edge.

A modern tuck-in selvedge shows. Plain and simple - the tartan looks different and feels different in the turned part (that's about 5/8" from the edge). The color isn't the same, and the texture isn't the same. And that's not including any "fuzz" that sometimes shows up where the threads are cut. If the tartan sett is carefully laid out, the color difference is minimized, but you still have twice as many weft threads in that 5/8" than elsewhere in the tartan, and it's thicker and stiffer. If the tartan sett isn't laid out carefully, however, the turned back threads can make it look like the colors have bled. Some of you remember that first run of 13 oz XMarks tartan.....

I am not a fan of a tuck-in selvedge. Not much you can do about it, though, as most mills have gone that route. If I remember correctly, however (and Matt can correct me if I'm wrong), House of Edgar just spent a lot of money on looms that do a traditional closed selvedge. And D.C. Dalgliesh does all of their custom weaves on a traditional loom as well, and they have far and away the nicest tartan on the market, in my estimation. It is a dream to make a kilt from. Ask Rex Tremende - his new kilt is a Dalgliesh custom weave, and it is spectacular fabric. Same with McMurdo's British Royal Naval Association tartan.

[ardchoille]

If I remember correctly, however (and Matt can correct me if I'm wrong), House of Edgar just spent a lot of money on looms that do a traditional closed selvedge. And D.C. Dalgliesh does all of their custom weaves on a traditional loom as well, and they have far and away the nicest tartan on the market, in my estimation. It is a dream to make a kilt from.

I believe you are correct.. I read this in a post he made not too long ago.

[Rex_Tremende]

It is a dream to make a kilt from. Ask Rex Tremende - his new kilt is a Dalgliesh custom weave, and it is spectacular fabric.

My kilt is a dream.

Here are some macro shots of the selvedge edge:




You can still see the tiny loom sprocket holes - I expect they'll eventually close themselves up - but there is no break in the twill. There's a wee bit of roughness where the colors change...



...but it is not apparent from when seen from a different angle. And here's just a gratuitous pile of pleats seen on edge:



Regards,
Rex.

[Huoliuhi]

thanks a lot , bump up up up!!