Need advice/help; I'm sorely confused...

[Derek Conley]

Good day all,

I recently contacted the Stewart Society inquiring about joining, etc. In my message to them, I obviously listed my surname and stated how it's always found under the sept lists for Stewart of Appin. I'll show a few quick links below to illustrate (for all of them, just scan down for "Conley) :

http://www.4crests.com/clafaf.html

http://www.men-in-kilts.com/mill-tex...e-index-c.html

http://www.electricscotland.com/webc...z/stewart.html

Those are just a small amount of links.

I received a response from the Society, and the e-mail is listed below:

"Dear Mr Conley,

I do not have a note of the name Conley being a Sept of the Stewarts of Appin, however it is associated with the name McLay, McLea etc. The Gaelic rendering of the name is Mac-an-Leigh. They are connected with the Livingston of Bachuil whose ancestor Donald Livingston succeeded in saving the clan banner of the Stewarts of Appin at the '45 and which the Stewart Society presented to the Nation and is in the Royal Museum of Scotland.

You will find details of joining the Society on our web-site www.stewartsociety.org

I would think that Conley is an anglised version of the Gaelic.

Kind regards,
"



So... can you see my confusion? I'm posting here as I've no clue what do to at this point; I did e-mail back and listed a few of those same links in hopes they can help clear this up a bit.

I'm just lost! I've been told of the Stewart of Appin link for years; Conley is always listed under that.

Doing some research, I believe the responder, by saying "Conley" is the anglised version may be also be referring to "MacOnlea" or "McOnlea".

I refer then to the The Clan MacLea - the Highland Livingstones page, and please see the first sentence, mentioning "McOnlea".

I apologize for the length of the post, but I appreciate it if you've read this far. Any and all input/advice is welcome at this point!

EDIT: Upon referencing this page's list, I note that "MacLeay" and "Livingstone" are listed as septs of Stewart of Appin. Now perhaps the "Conley" association with those clans has since, over the years, morphed into being listed as its own sept in and of itself?

I'll also cite this (From the same link as above)
"The Adherents or "septs" of Appin stem from families that lived in Lorn prior to the Stewarts gaining the Lordship. These were/are the MacColls, who descended from Black Solomon, son of Coll, son of the Lord of the Isles, The MacLeays or Livingstones (anglicized from MacLeay), who were reported to be on Lismore in 1130, but who's heritage is so old that know one really knows their beginnings..."

My point here is that on other pages, it's been mentioned that listing "MacLay/MacLea/Livingstone, et al" as septs of Stewart of Appin may be in error due to the clan being much older. Again, I citeThe Clan MacLea - the Highland Livingstones page, last sentence, for reference.

I need asprin.

[Downix]

The Stewart Society is sometimes unusual. They might need references.

[Riverkilt]

Ya gotta love volunteers.

Sure mean well.

Of course the best way is to be able to trace back your own lineage and see where it ends up. A most daunting, and addicting enterprise. Proceed with caution.

Ron

[Kilted in Maine]

So... can you see my confusion?
I need aspirin.

Now you have me confused!

Is your intent to join the clan or educate them?

If you wish to join, it appears he gave you the link to do so. Unfortunately you may only be open to status as an Associate Member. The connection you are attempting to make (or point out that has it already has been made) may still only avail you of associate membership.

Membership is open to all who bear the name of Stewart (in any form of spelling) or who are Stewarts by birth or descent. Associate Membership is open to those having a special connection with the Stewarts or a special interest in their history. The Objects of the Society are philanthropic, historical, genealogical, and to further kinship.

If your intent is to educate them, that made done more efficiently as a member.

Good Luck either way!

[macwilkin]

I would be very, very cautious with several of the links you listed as references. The first link is a so-called "bucket shop"; the term refers to a store that sells so-called "family crests" and family histories. Be very weary of information from such places, as the whole notion of a "family crest" is bogus in Scottish heraldry -- arms belong to individuals, not surnames.

Ron had the best advice:

Of course the best way is to be able to trace back your own lineage and see where it ends up.

That is really the only sure way to know. If you can trace your line back to lands traditionally associated with the Appin Stewarts, then you're good to go. But it appears that the Stewart Society doesn't recognize Conley as a "sept" -- of course, the whole notion of sept lists is a slippery slope anyway...

Regards,

Todd

[gilmore]

...
Of course the best way is to be able to trace back your own lineage and see where it ends up. A most daunting, and addicting enterprise. Proceed with caution.

Ron

What Ron said.

It's very tempting to want to to make connections based on nothing more than a surname, but there really, really is no (or maybe only one*) alternative to the long and sometimes arduous work of tracing one's ancestors backward in time via the paper trail, solidly establishing one generation at a time before moving on to their parents. One skips over generations and works forward in time to the present at one's peril, and one can end up constructing a genealogical edifice built on sand that can all come tumbling down when only one or two inconvenient facts are discovered.

Working with the slow but reliable genealogical methods has many satisfying advantages. You can be assured that the work is acurrate, not fantasy. You can know to a high degree of certainty that these people you come across are your own ancestors, not some one else's. And quite often you come across stories that are as interesting, if not moreso, than often repeated ones you hear elsewhere, such as who saved what banner in which battle, etc. Also, there is the adventure of not knowing where it will end up, of where your research will lead, of boldly going where no man has gone before, etc.

*The one alternative to tracing the paper trail is genetic genealogy by DNA testing, especially testing one's Y DNA chromosomes for one's patrilineal ancestry. It will show you the men you are most closely related to, and some of them will, no doubt, have solid research to earlier times, so it can give you an idea of where to research further, as well as where it would likely be fruitless to research. (Tracing one's matrilineal line through testing mitochondrial DNA is also possible, but isn't usually as helpful in genealogical research, since surnames are most often passed on patrilineally.) Genetic genealogy is in its infancy, having been commerically available less than nine years, but it is growing. You may not discover much now, but more evidence may come to light in the years and even months to come as more people test.

For more info, so to www.familytreedna.com and take a look at their FAQ.

Family Tree DNA has the largest database of all the genetic genealogy testing companies, and therefore you are more likely to find matches there than else where. You can also enter your test results at www.ysearch.org to compare them with results from other companies.

The cost of Y DNA testing is about $100 to $300, but you can or could get a discount by going through one of Family Tree DNA's surname projects. In fact, I see that there is a Conley surname project here: http://www.worldfamilies.net/surnames/conley/ Most of their earliest ancestors are American, but one is traced to Ireland and another to Dundee. All but one are in the R1b haplogroup, the predominate one in the British Isles.

Good luck!

[Derek Conley]

Now you have me confused!

Is your intent to join the clan or educate them?

Ah! Well, more the former and not the latter; I was simply trying to show the individual what I'd found (and been told for years, including by family) in hopes they could simply clear anything up. I most certainly don't want to attempt to educate the Society, as I'd absolutely defer to what they had to say.

Just seems that a whole new potential chapter has opened up and unfortunately, I've no elders left in my family to ask, so it's a task left to me.

In addition to this, I'm also currently trying to re-establish my lineage to a Signer of the Declaration of Independence as well as the Constitution, George Clymer, in order to join the Sons of the American Revolution... so it's all rather daunting at the moment.

I think I should just relax!

Thank you all for your input; I'm really quite a neophyte to all of this and I appreciate your patience.

[Downix]

Ah! Well, more the former and not the latter; I was simply trying to show the individual what I'd found (and been told for years, including by family) in hopes they could simply clear anything up. I most certainly don't want to attempt to educate the Society, as I'd absolutely defer to what they had to say.

Just seems that a whole new potential chapter has opened up and unfortunately, I've no elders left in my family to ask, so it's a task left to me.

In addition to this, I'm also currently trying to re-establish my lineage to a Signer of the Declaration of Independence as well as the Constitution, George Clymer, in order to join the Sons of the American Revolution... so it's all rather daunting at the moment.

I think I should just relax!

Thank you all for your input; I'm really quite a neophyte to all of this and I appreciate your patience.

I fully understand and appreciate your fustration here.

[RockyR]

Those Stewarts are ALWAYS confused... They have no idea WHAT they're doing.

(please note my business partner / girlfriend Kelly's last name is Stewart)

[Downix]

Those Stewarts are ALWAYS confused... They have no idea WHAT they're doing.

(please note my business partner / girlfriend Kelly's last name is Stewart)

That's not Archies grand-girl is it?