Wearing kilts of other tartans than your clans.

[Bugbear]

Just to help Nighthawk out a little... I think he is talking about the belted plaid blending in with the forest, and that is discussed at Matt Newsome's web site, I believe.

Where Nighthawk goes off course is in assuming that historical practices translate into tradition. The belted plaid is not traditional, nor is choosing a tartan by fashion; rather it was a historical practice.

As I understand the term "traditional" to mean, as defined by the traditionalists on the forum, a tradition must be an historical practice that has continued into the here and now without interuption and very little change. It is a bit different than historical revival or reenactment, which is Nighthawk's angle on this.

I'm only pointing out where the miscommunication is; I'm not trying to argue either point.

[Colonel MacNeal]

I tried to ask permission from the Clan Chattan association to wear MacQueen, but they told me there was nobody with any MacQueen authority to ask.

[Swampthing]

I tried to ask permission from the Clan Chattan association to wear MacQueen, but they told me there was nobody with any MacQueen authority to ask.

Because there isn't. They don't mind if you wear it.

My new metaphor for tartans: team colors.
Let's say we have two universities, USON and MCU.
And I'll just call them University of South Ontario and Mary's Catholic University, respectively. Now USON's team colors are brown and orange, like Autumn or something; MCU's colors are gold and purple.
If you go to MCU, and you are kind of enthusiastic, you are like a MacLeod that cares about his clan, if not then you are like a MacLeod who probably doesn't even know about his heritage. So, let's go with the former, you wear some gold and purple because those are the official colors of the university, and it's team. If your not at an event related to the university/team, would it be wrong to wear any other color?
Or simply would it be wrong to wear any other color? Would the guys at USON get mad if you wore orange and brown? Would they even have a justified reason? See? It's no different with Clans and their tartans, those tartans are simply tartans that their chieftain or whoever chose as their official tartan(s);
Just like team colors being the official colors of the team and/or university.
Although I guess teams usually aren't just college sports. ;)

[Bugbear]

Team colors?

I suppose...

[MacMillan of Rathdown]

I tried to ask permission from the Clan Chattan association to wear MacQueen, but they told me there was nobody with any MacQueen authority to ask.

On the death in 1881 of John Fraser Macqueen of Correyborough, then regarded as chief, the chiefly line passed to his brother, Lachlan, who died in 1896. He was succeeded in the chiefship by his son, Donald, who at the time was understood to be living in New Zealand. And here the trail grows cold...

That said, it should be a simple matter to track down Donald's birth records (assuming he was born in Scotland and not British India). A cross check with death records in NZ for all "Donald Macqueens" in the period 1900-1940 may elicit a clew as to the whereabouts of the heir of the missing Macqueen Chief.

[GlassMan]

Personally, in regards to traditional tartan kilts I own either my clan's tartans, universal tartans or fashion tartans. The one tartan of another clan which I occassionally wear is the one of the tartan's of my beloved grandmother's clan. I wear it to honor her. Of course, I also have several solid modern kilts but those have absolutely no association at all. I hold the belief that if one wears a tartan one should know the history of that clan and be able to answer any questions from curious onlookers and thus represent that clan well in public.

I am tempted by that "Jewish" tartan since it is simply a fashion tartan and not really an official tartan as recognized by any governing body and, well, I rather like it. Besides, it would be perfect for my trips to the gym/pool. Though I'm not Jewish I do have a membership at the local Jewish Community Center. One day, as I walked into the locker room to change, two older Jewish members saw me wearing my kilt. The first one said, "I didn't know that there were any Scottish Jews." His friend replied, "Of course there are Scottish Jews, we're everywhere!" I think it would be so much fun to see them again and inform them that I am wearing a "jewish" tartan. At least we'd get to relive that conversation and have a good chuckle together.

[GlassMan]

Oh, and I forgot to make a mention of the concept of tartan as camouflage.

If great kilts were supposed to be camo then I'd hate to see what the region looks like around the Loud McLouds! If the plants and trees are naturally those colors, it's a miracle that an invading army was able to see anything!

[gilmore]

<<<Quote:
Originally Posted by JSFMACLJR
No, the traditional thing to do is to wear your clan tartan, or barring that, a district tartan.

The one thing that you're missing in this statement is that, while this is a tradition, it is a recent one. >>>

200 years is "recent?"

<<<If you want to go with older traditions, the tradition is in fact to wear the one that you like best. You have to remember the whole point of tartan in the first place- it was used as camoflage- not fashion. >>>

One of the oldest tartans is the red Morrison, from the mid 18th century. A more vibrant and raucous collection of colors you probably haven't seen.

[Bugbear]

I looked over at Matt Newsome's web site. He quotes "George Buchanan's history of Scotland published in 1581," in the article, "The Early History of the Kilt," which says:


Their ancestors wore plaids of many colours, and numbers still retain this custom but the majority now in their dress prefer a dark brown, imitating nearly
the leaves of the heather, that when lying upon the heath in the day, they may not be discovered by the appearance of their clothes; in these wrapped rather
than covered, they brave the severest storms in the open air, and sometimes lay themselves down to sleep even in the midst of snow.

However, Matt Newsome goes on to point out that this does not specifically
refer to the belted plaid, and it predates the first known record of the belted plaid in 1594.

The linked to article is a good read and gives a better context for all this.