A Modern Scottish View of Clans (and Gathering)

[Phil]

The idea of America as a pure egalitarian meritocracy is as much a myth as any idealized picture of clan life, but it is true that we allow for the possibility that anyone can become anything if they have the energy, persistence and will to make it happen, and we celebrate those who succeed. While some of us may "revere" a Princess or a clan chief in a romantic way, I don't see us granting either any meaningful authority over our lives.

Remember that while you may, possibly, become the President of your country through effort, persistence, possibly ability and no doubt shed-loads of cash, you cannot ever, in any circumstances, no matter how much you wish or try, become a clan chief because that depends solely upon an accident of birth. Something that none of us can overcome no matter how much we may wish or try for it. But what, precisely, does such an accident of birth confer upon an individual that makes him (I say him deliberately because primogeniture is another essential part of the deal here) such a suitable candidate for the job? Answers please on the back of a postage stamp - if you can actually think of any that is. I suppose that places you in a similar situation as me in that I cannot ever become the Head of State in my country for exactly the same reason. There are many obstacles placed in our path as we make our way through life but ones such as these that deny even the possibility are indefensible, unsupportable and should be swept away as your forefathers so sensibly decided all those years ago.

[duchessofnc]

Remember that while you may, possibly, become the President of your country through effort, persistence, possibly ability and no doubt shed-loads of cash, you cannot ever, in any circumstances, no matter how much you wish or try, become a clan chief because that depends solely upon an accident of birth. Something that none of us can overcome no matter how much we may wish or try for it. But what, precisely, does such an accident of birth confer upon an individual that makes him (I say him deliberately because primogeniture is another essential part of the deal here) such a suitable candidate for the job? Answers please on the back of a postage stamp - if you can actually think of any that is. I suppose that places you in a similar situation as me in that I cannot ever become the Head of State in my country for exactly the same reason. There are many obstacles placed in our path as we make our way through life but ones such as these that deny even the possibility are indefensible, unsupportable and should be swept away as your forefathers so sensibly decided all those years ago.

Phil, I am not even going to try to argue with you on your stance though I do believe you are correct on many points. With the exception of primogeniture. The Clan MacKinnon chief is a woman. Her name is Madam Anne Gunhild Mackinnon of Mackinnon, 38th Chief of the Name and Arms of Mackinnon.

Now unfortunately, she's in line for her clan merely because her father had no male heirs, however, it is better than it has been. The fact that she could inherit and it not skip over her to the next living male heir. So in that, the monarchy tradition is now being adopted. Unfortunately, things have not changed to the point that whomever is born first gets titles first whether they be male or female has not been completely eradicated. Though one European country has passed a law (this year I believe) that in fact does that for their monarchy. Denmark I think, but, I could be wrong. I get confused between the countries in the pocket of Denmark.

[Phil]

Phil, I am not even going to try to argue with you on your stance though I do believe you are correct on many points. With the exception of primogeniture. The Clan MacKinnon chief is a woman. Her name is Madam Anne Gunhild Mackinnon of Mackinnon, 38th Chief of the Name and Arms of Mackinnon.

I didn't mean to imply that women cannot inherit as the example you quote illustrates that indeed they can, just as our Queen did on the death of her father. Had she had a younger brother, however, we would then have had a King XXXX rather than a queen just as would have been the case with the chief you describe. The point of my argument was, in fact, that neither you, nor I, nor any other person could ever aspire to be chief. Not because we are in any way unfit or undeserving but simply because our father was not the chief before us.

[gilmore]

.... I get confused between the countries in the pocket of Denmark.

Denmark has pockets?

[Bugbear]

Remember that while you may, possibly, become the President of your country through effort, persistence, possibly ability and no doubt shed-loads of cash, you cannot ever, in any circumstances, no matter how much you wish or try, become a clan chief because that depends solely upon an accident of birth. Something that none of us can overcome no matter how much we may wish or try for it. But what, precisely, does such an accident of birth confer upon an individual that makes him (I say him deliberately because primogeniture is another essential part of the deal here) such a suitable candidate for the job? Answers please on the back of a postage stamp - if you can actually think of any that is. I suppose that places you in a similar situation as me in that I cannot ever become the Head of State in my country for exactly the same reason. There are many obstacles placed in our path as we make our way through life but ones such as these that deny even the possibility are indefensible, unsupportable and should be swept away as your forefathers so sensibly decided all those years ago.

Phil, the founding fathers of America started
the ball rolling, and the rest came in very hard won steps. Many of the people who worked or fought the hardest to have their freedoms and rights recognized, didn't live to enjoy them. It's still going on, so hang in there.