Tartan Sett Thread Counts - A Question for the Experts

[Morgan of Seattle]

This question occurred to me from Chas' post in my thread about a new tartan design. This seems like a new thread, though.

I've been using the Scotweb store's new online software to design a tartan in honor of my father. In the online information they provide, they state that a thread count of 216-288 is best for making kilts. Most setts are symmetrical, though. The pattern is repeated in reverse, each time. My design is asymmetrical, no reverse repeats.

Does this mean that the ideal thread count for kilt making would be doubled, or am I thinking about this incorrectly?

Any expert help will be greatly appreciated!

Cheers,
Philip

[M. A. C. Newsome]

Philip,

Having looked at the tartan you designed in the other thread (nice tartan, BTW) I have to say it looks like a symmetrical tartan to me. Maybe you can post a thread count for us?

But yes, whether a tartan is symmetrical will affect the sett size. For example, let's say your tartan pattern is represented as ABCDE. Well, in a normal symmetrical tartan, the pattern would go:
ABCDEDCBABCDEDCBA

So, to get from "A" to the next "A" would require a jump of 8 letters.

But now let's say you had that pattern woven as an asymmetrical tartan. It would run like this:
ABCDEABCDEABCDE

Now, to get from "A" to the next "A" in the pattern only requires a jump of 5 letters. So the sett repeat is now smaller, because you have not reversed the pattern.

[Morgan of Seattle]

Hi Matt,

The thread count for Morgan of Maryland (at least so far) is :

LG36 DT4 LG22 DT22 A36 K2 R8 K2 A36 DT22 LG22 DT4 LG36 K2 B8 K2 where LG=Light Green DT=Dark Brown A=Azure K=Black R=Scarlet B=Blue

I believe it is actually asymmetrical because the red and blue stripes (the ones outlined in black: K2 R8 K2 and K2 B8 K2) are alternating. I think that if it were symmetrical I would have two red stripes then two blue stripes then two red, etc. Everything else about this sett appears symmetrical, though.

But my question really is whether this sett size will be good for kilt making. According to the Scotweb software, this sett will be 7.3 inches wide in 16 oz. wool.

[M. A. C. Newsome]

Ok, here is where the confusion is as to why you think it is assymetrical while everyone that looks at it sees a symmetrical tartan.

The thread count, as you have written it out, if woven as an assymetrical tartan (repeating the same thread count, left to right, without reversing), will yeild the tartan that you pictured in the other thread, which is -- as it turns out -- a symmetrical tartan. But the symmetry is actually within the thread count you designed.

The normal way to write the thread count for this tartan design, which woven as a symmetrical tartan would yield the exact same tartan as you have pictured, is this:

R8 K2 A36 DT22 LG22 DT4 LG36 K2 B8

The red stripe and the blue stripe are the pivots in this symmetrical design.

On the other question, if the sett repeat is 7.3" as you say, then yes, this will be good for kiltmaking.

[M. A. C. Newsome]

Another way to put what I just said is that you wrote out the "full sett" (including the reversing repeat), whereas the normal way to record the tartan would be to simply write the "half sett" (where it is understood that the tartan reverses on the pivots).

[Morgan of Seattle]

Ah ha! The light of reason and superior knowledge dawns.

Thanks Matt!

[Morgan of Seattle]

BTW, for anyone who might use the Scotweb tartan design software, there are apparently many tartans in their database for which they have written an asymmetrical thread count (just like I did) when it could actually be written symmetrically. It was the MacLeod (Clan) tartan that led me astray until Matt straightened me out.