Thanks for info! I have a Kate Cushing 8yd 16oz Blackwatch that was made for our pipeband and an MOD Blackwatch. I just emailed Kate for info... Of course I'm looking at a MacNewsome Davidson from Davidlpope. Of course I just saw the Cthulhu Tartan thread and want an 8yd 16oz Black box pleat with Tartan inserts.... Oi.. :-P