So it's not a skirt (or maybe it is). And the point is...?

[Livingston]

Thank you very much. As a matter of fact, I notice a lot of guys have nothing but priase for their wives, girlfriends, and mothers, but say they do anything like a woman, and it's a deadly insult. I wonder then how true that praise must be.

That's because it's an insult to my wife and my mother to think that I would be up on their level.

There...did that work Shay?

[Joe Gondek]

Shay

I would like to believe that there are worse things that can happen to a guy than to be compared to a woman,

When the Donner Party met with their fate while crossing the Sierra Mountains,(Surviving a snow bound winter) 2/3 of the men died
and 2/3 of the women surived.

It might be considered quite an insult to women to equate kilted men to the female half of the population.

[Richland]

On that note, It is documented that women survive hardship, famine, to include the Holocaust, etc. better than men.
The weaker sex I think not
The fairer sex indeed.

[KiltedPilot]

Some interesting thoughts gentlemen.

Personally I rarely find ambiguity in a 'nice skirt' remark. I almost always know if it is a genuine compliment, playful jest, a brainless drunken off-the-cuff remark, or a deliberate insult. I then know how to deal with it.

There is just too much information in the intonation, facial expression, and body language, to leave much room for ambiguity.

I do find a gender difference. Women don't have a hangup with the word 'skirt', and frequently enthuse over the idea of 'men in skirts' when they see my kilt. Men have a BIG hangup about the word 'skirt'. I don't recall ANY guy complimenting me on my 'skirt', but will compliment my 'kilt'.

But if a guy, or a girl, with a big warm smile, and a thumbs up, says 'nice skirt' to me -- I'll accept the compliment as graciously as it was given.

KP.

[cloves]

even in the last few months become more open minded???
I don't know what it is lately, but I find the posting (when it comes to these 'heavier' subjects anyway) to be more more apprecitative and respectful of each other's views and opinions. I for one really like the new direction the board seems to be moving in. hrmmm...maybe I'm becoming less defensive?

Anyway, getting back to what Rex was saying in the first place...
For those of you who don't know, I'm female, and by times even I take offense when somebody says to me "nice skirt" with a sarcastic tone. I can tell when it's an insult as opposed to a compliment.
The thing is, maybe I dislike it when somebody calls it a skirt because it does feminize me, and i've never been a girly girl. It's not being a girl that bothers me so much ( I am!) it's the fact that I don't want to be percieved as something not powerful. I think internally we must asscoiate female with weak perhaps. That's something I've got to work on. Letting go of preconcieved notions about gender and what it means to me male or female.

I'm starting to give myself a headache...been thinking too much. argh

[pdcorlis]

Very thoughtful post Rex. I'm always amused and amazed by those who think I'm in need of their opinions. When a total stranger feels compelled to "share" with me I think about my father who always suggested it would be best if I just worried about keeping my side of the street clean.

[KiltedKnight]

Thank you very much. As a matter of fact, I notice a lot of guys have nothing but priase for their wives, girlfriends, and mothers, but say they do anything like a woman, and it's a deadly insult. I wonder then how true that praise must be.

I served 21 years as a soldier, I learned all of the soldier stuff including how to sew, mend my own socks, press my clothes, wash dishes and pots and pans, make my bunk/bed, clean my room to the point that someone wearing a white glove couldn't find any dirt. My point? since the ratio of servicemen to civilians is so small I can say that if necessary I can make war better than most men because that was my job and what I was trained to do and today I can keep a house just as good if not better than a woman.
Meaning no offence to womenkind I have to say that if a man cannot do what a woman can do how can he call himself her equal?
I find no disgrace in having the ability to maintain my own clothing, I work hand in hand with my wife, as she holds a regular job as well and I help her gladly do the laundry, wash the dishes, vacuum, etc., but also on my off days or when I forget to take my "chill pills" as my wife calls them I am still able to put some smart *** flat on his *** if need be.
Sorry, but I have to laugh at the clown who tries to put the kilt down in any way because this clown doesn't know what I know nor is he able to do what I can do. That in my opinion makes the clown only half a man.

Chris.

[timber]

One of my co-workers calls it a skirt. She does know that it is more precise to call it a kilt, and has even corrected other people who call it a skirt, but when we are talking about it she still calls it a skirt. I really don't mind that, because she means no disrespect. That's just the way she is.

[Scott Gilmore]

Thank you very much. As a matter of fact, I notice a lot of guys have nothing but priase for their wives, girlfriends, and mothers, but say they do anything like a woman, and it's a deadly insult. I wonder then how true that praise must be.

Well stated, Rex, I appreciate the thought being given this topic.

Shay, the reason being compared to a woman is often insulting is because often it's meant as an insult. It has nothing to do with gender. Frankly, I don't care what someone says to me; if it's meant to be an insult, I consider myself insulted. The words don't make a difference, the intention does. The words usually only serve to convey how insulting someone wants to be.

Beyond that though, it is, in my opinion, perfectly normal to vest your identity with your gender - to associate who you are and how you should behave to some extent (not completely, mind you, that would be a broader subject) with not only your gender, but also your sexuality. We are natural creatures after all, that's just the reality of it, and denying it does no good.

So when a kilt is referred to as a skirt, it seems natural to respond pretty much every time, not to ignore the comment. Either the other party simply doesn't know the difference, in which case I feel a certain social responsibility to help them avoid such a faux pas going forward, or they are being "cute" (it isn't, so a polite, gentle-but-firmly correction is in order), or they really are being rude. If they are being rude, it's up to us to determine the degree of insult and, if we chose to, respond in measure. Usually such an incident - rare as it is - amounts to nothing. I've never been in anything like a scuffle because of such behavior.

Thank you,
Scott Gilmore

[Blu (Ontario)]

... I guess the point is everyone here understands that a kilt is a man's garment...

If this was true, there wouldn't be a need to "trick-up" the kilt with sporrans, daggers, and other traditional kit to "declare" that it's masculine. There remains much insecurity even amongst commited kilt weareres.

... Not everyone not here has the same understanding. Some do, but they are not comfortable with the notion.

It is a mental challenge that some people don't seem to cope with easily. I suspect that the ones that squawk the loudest are usually the most insecure.:rolleyes: