District Tartans?

[###KILTEDKIWI###]

could they wear a Cunningham tartan

Mate, as a Cunningham, people have no idea what the tartan is, and have even had comments like "is that a MacDonald?" and other various types of tartans.

My old lady (mother) is/was a Mcleod, and when i was getting my kilt built, quite frankly stated " I hope its not that ghastly (changed terminology) red one"...

Note that the Ayrshire tartan may be worn by anyone with connections to the districts of Cunningham, Kyle and Inverclyde.

Bet an educated Montgomery wouldnt wear it...

[Morris at Heathfield]

1) It's a connection. However, most anyone who recognized the tartan would assume you were a Cunningham, or at least a descendant of one. As for criticism, there's probably no way to predict it, or even to prevent it. For every person who might raise an eyebrow at your wearing of the Cunningham tartan, there's probably another person who will insist you're wearing the Ramsay tartan.

2) Clan and district tartans tend to be kept separate, but there are exceptions. A case in point is the Angus tartan, designed some time around the turn of the (20th) century. No one's really sure if it was intended as a family or district tartan, so it's used as both. (Note: Angus was known as Forfarshire at the time; however, the tartan might have been named after the Earldom of Angus.) The district association seems to be the most prevalent, however. On the other hand, the Campbell of Cawdor tartan was used as a district (and military) tartan for Argyll before it came to be associated with the Cawdor branch of the family. Now the family association has prevailed.

3) Campbells shouldn't mind others wearing the Black Watch tartan because, according to the experts on the subject (the late James Scarlett and Alastair Campbell of Airds), the Campbells wear the Black Watch tartan.

[am1745]

A lot of the clans in the north east of scotland wore the Huntly District tartan at Culloden, and it is a really nice tartan too but very expensive or i would buy some!!

[macwilkin]

1) It's a connection. However, most anyone who recognized the tartan would assume you were a Cunningham, or at least a descendant of one. As for criticism, there's probably no way to predict it, or even to prevent it. For every person who might raise an eyebrow at your wearing of the Cunningham tartan, there's probably another person who will insist you're wearing the Ramsay tartan.

2) Clan and district tartans tend to be kept separate, but there are exceptions. A case in point is the Angus tartan, designed some time around the turn of the (20th) century. No one's really sure if it was intended as a family or district tartan, so it's used as both. (Note: Angus was known as Forfarshire at the time; however, the tartan might have been named after the Earldom of Angus.) The district association seems to be the most prevalent, however. On the other hand, the Campbell of Cawdor tartan was used as a district (and military) tartan for Argyll before it came to be associated with the Cawdor branch of the family. Now the family association has prevailed.

3) Campbells shouldn't mind others wearing the Black Watch tartan because, according to the experts on the subject (the late James Scarlett and Alastair Campbell of Airds), the Campbells wear the Black Watch tartan.

Morris,

In regards to your second point, the Cumming Hunting Tartan is also the old Buchan District tartan, and the Hunting Macpherson is the also the Badenoch tartan -- both were lands of the respective clans that controlled them.

Regards,

Todd

[Jock Scot]

All this talk of district tartans is very interesting and somewhat theoretical and I think that, in some cases, their ancestry is actually older than some of the older clan tartans, I stand to be corrected on that point. However, in real life, certainly in the highlands, they are almost irrelevant. I know of no one here that would consider wearing a district tartan,other than in a pipe band, even if anyone knew that they actually exist and very,very few do.

[macwilkin]

All this talk of district tartans is very interesting and somewhat theoretical and I think that, in some cases, their ancestry is actually older than some of the older clan tartans, I stand to be corrected on that point. However, in real life, certainly in the highlands, they are almost irrelevant. I know of no one here that would consider wearing a district tartan,other than in a pipe band, even if anyone knew that they actually exist and very,very few do.

I'm sorry, but I respectfully disagree Jock, as someone who wears two district tartans: one to honour the land where my immigrant ancestors settled, and the other which is actually my clan tartan.

To myself (and others I daresay) they are hardly irrelevant, but symbols of my pride in my ancestry and the accomplishments of my ancestors in their new country -- soldiers, farmers and educators, active in various civic, patriotic and fraternal organisations, Presbyterians, etc.

Please remember that for those who have no connection to a clan, but rather a connection a geographic location in Scotland, the district tartan is just as relevant.

Respectfully,

Todd

[Jock Scot]

I'm sorry, but I respectfully disagree Jock, as someone who wears two district tartans: one to honour the land where my immigrant ancestors settled, and the other which is actually my clan tartan.

To myself (and others I daresay) they are hardly irrelevant, but symbols of my pride in my ancestry and the accomplishments of my ancestors in their new country -- soldiers, farmers and educators.

Remember that for those who have no connection to a clan, but rather a connection a geographic location in Scotland, the district tartan is just as relevant.

Respectfully,

Todd

Todd with the greatest of respect, most people, probably, in Scotland and most certainly in the highlands would have no idea what you are talking about when it comes to district tartans. In fact I would go as far as saying that they have little relevance here at all. Sorry.

[macwilkin]

Todd with the greatest of respect, most people, probably, in Scotland and most certainly in the highlands would have no idea what you are talking about when it comes to district tartans. In fact I would go as far as saying that they have little relevance here at all. Sorry.

But that wasn't my point, Jock. For me personally, the district tartan concept is relevant. You of course are free to disagree, and I respect that, and I would hope you would return the same.

And regardless, the district tartan is very much relevant in the history of tartans, especially the development of the clan tartan. Noted tartan scholars such as Brian Wilton (a Scot), James Scarlett and Matt Newsome all agree on this fact. So I would argue, as a historian, they are very much relevant, especially since a number of clan tartans are also district ones.

Much of the US history I teach in my classes is not well known to my students, but that doesn't make it any less relevant.

T.

[Jock Scot]

But that wasn't my point, Jock. For me personally, the district tartan concept is relevant. You of course are free to disagree, and I respect that, and I would hope you would return the same.

And regardless, the district tartan is very much relevant in the history of tartans, especially the development of the clan tartan. Noted tartan scholars such as Brian Wilton (a Scot), James Scarlett and Matt Newsome all agree on this fact. So I would argue, as a historian, they are very much relevant, especially since a number of clan tartans are also district ones.

T.

As I have said and with the greatest of respect.District tartans to us Scots are mainly irrelevant. Don't forget we have our own clan tartans! We don't need to "grasp at straws"(sorry, I can't think of a better way of saying it) to find/demonstrate a Scots connection. As a theoretical historical fact there is no doubting their ancestry. As to day to day use, and as I have respectfully pointed out, district tartans are mostly unknown and mostly unworn,in Scotland. I have no argument with the gentlemen you mention as, of course, from a historical and theoretical point of view, they are correct.

[macwilkin]

As I have said and with the greatest of respect.District tartans to us Scots are mainly irrelevant. Don't forget we have our own clan tartans! We don't need to "grasp at straws"(sorry, I can't think of a better way of saying it) to find/demonstrate a Scots connection. As a theoretical historical fact there is no doubting their ancestry. As to day to day use, and as I have respectfully pointed out, district tartans are mostly unknown and mostly unworn,in Scotland. I have no argument with the gentlemen you mention as, of course, from a historical and theoretical point of view, they are correct.

Jock,

I think we agree more than we disagree, so we'll leave it at that.

Respectfully,

Todd