A Tale of Two Paintings

[Nick the DSM]

Also the colours of the second painting...

dreadful to my eye.

[clan campbell]

the uniform is the uniform of the 42nd RHR during the Revolutionary war

[longhuntr74]

the uniform is the uniform of the 42nd RHR during the Revolutionary war

...Disagree CC! The 42d, during the American Revolution, wore BLUE facings (the color worn by all "Royal" regiments) and the officers wore gold braid . These facings, at least in my eyes, are clearly GREEN with silver braid, indicating Hugh Montgomerie to be a member of the 77th Highlanders (called Montgomery's Highlanders after their Colonel, Archibold Montgomery)...see post #8. I was wrong on the event that the painting depicted...but stick by my call on the regiment!

[creagdhubh]

Actually, Peter, if it was painted in 1780 that would be DURING the American Revolution that started in 1774/5 (depending on whether you go with Lexington Green or Bunker Hill) and didn't end until 1783.



I agree with Peter...it's possible. Don't let the Native Americans guide your judgement here, though...there was just as much employment of Native Americans during the American Revolution as there was during the F&I War.

It's definitely the uniform of the 77th Highland Regiment (Montgomeries/Montgomerys) with the green lapels and silver trim. I know nothing about Hugh, but given the date of his birth (1739), he would have been 15-22 years old DURING the F&I War. Does anybody have any information regarding his years of military service? It is possible that he may have served as an ensign or something in the later years of the war...or post war. If he did serve during that period, this is not the coat he would have been wearing at the time...and that assertion is backed by a HUGE body of evidence.

In trying to make sense of this, historically, I've just stumbled upon something that might fit! Is it possible that this is a depiction of the 1763 "Battle of Bushy Run?" For those of you unfamiliar with this battle, it occurred when British Forces under the command of COL Henry Bouquet, who were marching to the relief of Fort Pitt then under siege by the native tribes led by Pontiac (Pontiac's Rebellion), were ambushed by Deleware and Shawnee Warriors. Among Bouquet's troops were elements of the 60th Royal Americans and the 42d and 77th Highlanders. See this post for a full description of the battle. Montgomerie would have been 24 at the time...more than old enough to serve as an officer in the 77th. This would definitely explain the background of the painting...romanticized, of course.

So how do we explain the wrong regimental coat?? Fairly simple in my mind. If the portrait was painted in 1780, I'd bet that Montgomerie "sat" for the painting in his current uniform (he looks a bit older than 24 in the painting, does he not?)...superimposed over the background scene from the 1763 battle (or another similar engagement).

Ugh...there goes my argument. Here is a list of the officers of the 77th in 1763. No Hugh Montgomery(ie) listed. It says the regiment was disbanded in 1763 as well. I'm assuming that it was reactivated at a later date?

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Well said, Jeffrey. An interesting topic of discussion, Richard, thanks for sharing.

Cheers,

[clan campbell]

...Disagree CC! The 42d, during the American Revolution, wore BLUE facings (the color worn by all "Royal" regiments) and the officers wore gold braid . These facings, at least in my eyes, are clearly GREEN with silver braid, indicating Hugh Montgomerie to be a member of the 77th Highlanders (called Montgomery's Highlanders after their Colonel, Archibold Montgomery)...see post #8. I was wrong on the event that the painting depicted...but stick by my call on the regiment!

officers wore gold facing and regular men wore silver facing. and the jacket design tell me its revolutionary

[OC Richard]

officers wore gold facing and regular men wore silver facing. and the jacket design tell me its revolutionary

No regiments wore gold facing or silver facing. The "facings" were the lapels on the front of the jacket, the collar, and cuffs, and were Buff, White, Yellow, Blue, or Dark Green. The "lace" was gold or silver depending on regiment.

Barnes gives the following table for 1800 (I've only included the kilted regiments)

Regiment/ Tartan/ Facings/ Lace

42nd/ 42nd/ Blue/ Gold

71st/ MacKenzie/ Buff/ Silver

72nd/ MacKenzie/ Yellow/ Silver

73rd/ 42nd/ Dark Green/ Gold

74th/ 42nd/ White/ Gold

75th/ Gordon/ Yellow/ Silver

78th/ MacKenzie/ Buff/ Gold

79th/ Cameron of Erracht/ Dark Green/ Gold

91st/ 42nd/ Yellow/ Silver

92nd/ Gordon/ Yellow/ Silver

93rd/ 42nd/ Yellow/ Silver

The 77th did not exist in 1800 but we are told that it wore Dark Green facings with Silver lace (interesting because regiments with Dark Green facings usually wore Gold lace.)

Yes indeed that jacket style is of 1780, when the painting was done, and quite different from the style of jacket worn 20 years earlier.

[creagdhubh]

No regiments wore gold facing or silver facing. The "facings" were the lapels on the front of the jacket, the collar, and cuffs, and were Buff, White, Yellow, Blue, or Dark Green. The "lace" was gold or silver depending on regiment.

Barnes gives the following table for 1800 (I've only included the kilted regiments)

Regiment/ Tartan/ Facings/ Lace

42nd/ 42nd/ Blue/ Gold

71st/ MacKenzie/ Buff/ Silver

72nd/ MacKenzie/ Yellow/ Silver

73rd/ 42nd/ Dark Green/ Gold

74th/ 42nd/ White/ Gold

75th/ Gordon/ Yellow/ Silver

78th/ MacKenzie/ Buff/ Gold

79th/ Cameron of Erracht/ Dark Green/ Gold

91st/ 42nd/ Yellow/ Silver

92nd/ Gordon/ Yellow/ Silver

93rd/ 42nd/ Yellow/ Silver

The 77th did not exist in 1800 but we are told that it wore Dark Green facings with Silver lace (interesting because regiments with Dark Green facings usually wore Gold lace.)

Yes indeed that jacket style is of 1780, when the painting was done, and quite different from the style of jacket worn 20 years earlier.

***

[georgeetta]

sporran

I got a funny feeling it may be leopard mounted against leather . American Revolutionary hero Gen Nicholas Herkimer who lost his leg and his life at Oriskany NY, was shot through the leg maybe killed his horse ..he was set up under the beech tree adn directed the fight sitting on his saddle . A famous stutue and paitings show his horse pistol holsters still in place ..horse pistols would be much bigger than normal if carrying on your belt . Well my pal owned his holsters he told me about them me being a great admirer of the general ..scarlet red wool and leopard ..he described them in detail and to me it was hard to put together ..then another pal was happy to show me his book he got form his sons ..on New York State artifacts ..and as I opened the book ..BAM !! opened right up to good ole Gen'l Nicholas' holsters onl htne could you admire the workmanship vs my imagination .

Also later on ..leopard is seen in many other works and decorations beign so exotic coming form Africa, either for effect or to exhibit the financial pockets of the owner .

wanna stand out from regular guys with badgers ..wear leopard !

an artifact now hanging on forever I was given spears from Africa by a WW2 officer ..they'd strips of calf or cow wound round for decoration and I think delicate leather lace dicing ..like beadwork, apparently it was a badge of office for a boy going to man ..had to kill lion with spear then it was turned into a sort of swagger stick for ..conversations . The hair being 62 yrs old ..not modern leather work factory tanned ..things can get rather ...well have you ever seen an old taxidemry mount !

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[georgeetta]

in a portrait in a studio ..on commission ..on field accuracy might take second compared to a rich officer wanting to be paited as best as he possibly could vs how he looked at this battle or that hike up the Hudson . ie art might lean toward drama . Wiered thing is our famous Major Duncan Campbell appears far left according to experts in a paiting showing Black Watch firing by platoons in ..Glasgow I think befor eembarking for America ..he sits on a horse in trousers and a tricorn and red jacket ..by drummers ..at least it hsows the men in plaids and bonnets what appears to be the Balmoral kind than the Hummel Bonnet in the Eglinton portrait . You really have to squint to get anything else . (jest) .

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