The Scots Have Influenced My Culture, What Do I Do?

[MacBean]

Bugbear,

Since when have Oaks originated in Mexico????????????
And how did they get to GB and the rest of Europe thousands and thousands of years ago??
I await your reply with interest!

(:-)
R.

Way off topic, but as it sliped in, here goes. In considering the origin of plant groups, scientists have usually considered that the place where the greatest number and variety of species exists is the ancestral origin of the group. Thus tropical Mexico, with a huge number (ca. 150) of oak species, many evergreen or semi-evergreens, is considered the ancestral home, with rights to control authentic tradition! The following may interest the botanically inclined:
http://danr.ucop.edu/ihrmp/proceed/nixon.pdf

What, you didn't know oaks were evergreen (Bugbear surely does where he lives)? In the US we call them live oaks and, for the most part, they are evergreen. Even the deciduous species in Europe or eastern North America retain their brown leaves throughout the winter, sort of like the emigrant Scots and their tartans! (gotta keep it on topic)

How did they get to Europe and when? Surely not thousands and thousands of years ago, more like tens of millions. This bit is perhaps even more interesting. China and Japan share a flora with the North America, especially the forests of Eastern N.America (oaks, maples, rhododendrons, redwoods, etc.). It is usually thought that the European species arrived overland from China rather than across the Atlantic(I figure about a yard a year would do, but acorns are loved by birds and move faster than that). They finally arrived in Scotland where they were used to dye the wool for our beloved kilts, make the inks used to print our Bibles, and furnish the wood for the ships that scattered us to the far corners of the world.

[wildrover]

Even the deciduous species in Europe or eastern North America retain their brown leaves throughout the winter, sort of like the emigrant Scots and their tartans! (gotta keep it on topic)

You just answered a question I've had for a while regarding the tree outside my home...I always wondered why it didn't drop its leaves...tho a good hailstorm does an adequate job of helping.

(I figure about a yard a year would do, but acorns are loved by birds and move faster than that)

Well, that all depends on the airspeed of...ok, I'll stop there. Nhi!

BB, are you saying you've lost track of your cultural individuality?

[Bugbear]

... BB, are you saying you've lost track of your cultural individuality?

I'm not sure what that term means.

I could provide a link with proof of why I can not follow in my family's footsteps, a tip of the iceberg example, but I am quite nervous about sending that as a PM. I would not post it on the open forum.

I posted that link to Electric Scotland in OP for a specific reason, it shows a Scottish tradition that most of my family does not have, or that my family is ashamed of in some cases, while falsely claiming to be Scottish. Go figure. :confused:

That was beaten out of me on day one of kindergarten, and other things have had to go over the years; finally the false Scottishness...

* I'm afraid I haven't been able to convey that very well and it's been a little frustrating.. Or in some cases it feels like I am having a conversation with a brick wall.

[Bugbear]

No, wildrover, I've made a mess of things with this, at least for myself; I realize that now.

[Bugbear]

Thanks, McElmurry.

And thanks again, Jock, for providing some input.

* Also as I said, the issue of non-kilt related topics, or the misunderstanding I had, was cleared up after I posted this thread. Kind of had a little scare for about twelve hours.
http://www.xmarksthescot.com/forum/f...c-forum-59913/

[Bugbear]

Thanks Mike, and other posters.

Also, thank you to the library folk, and people who work with books.

Some of the people I lived with, when I was a teenager, had a way of incorporating new things into their culture and heritage... It's difficult to explain. The strange thing is that their language, which I never got the hang of and could not speak well, does not add new words. Everything is a description in terms of something already in the language. A car has arms and legs for example, or something like that. There is also a very misunderstood concept that your world and history is in your head.

[Lachlan09]

The antipathy between peoples of different background, when living in a small town, is a sad thing.

I remember in the late 1950’s, when I was a small boy in Musselburgh (near Edinburgh), a wee town of never more than 18,000 souls, there was a watchmakers / jewelers shop in North High Street called “Baxter’s”. My Dad was friendly with the owner, a Pole. Mr Baxter had been in the exiled Polish Army in Scotland in WW2 and had trained there. He later fought in Italy and after he was demobbed, he settled back in Scotland, changed his name to Baxter and became British. I met Mr Baxter on many occasions as a boy and he was very nice.

Meanwhile, across the street, lived Mr Gerard Steinberg, with whom my dad was also friendly. Mr Steinberg was German and had been in the German Army in WW2. He had fought in North Africa and was captured in Tunisia. He spent the rest of the war in a British POW camp. After the war, he decided to stay in Scotland, settling down in Musselburgh. I believe he became naturalized also, marrying and settling down. I met Mr Steinberg on many occasions as a boy and he was also very nice.

Unfortunately those two nice men hated each other. I don’t need to explain here why - it’s obvious. But to me as a young boy, I couldn’t understand what was happening.

[Bugbear]

Thanks for posting, Lachlan09, I missed your post for some reason.

Kind of backing away from the History forum.

[Bugbear]

Here is a quote from a historian, who cajunscot suggested the other day, that speaks for it's self.

History is not, as someone once said, "just one damn thing after another." Unless it is badly taught or written, it is not a dry record of events; it is about how people experience, study, and interpret the past. Each generation reviews and rewrites history in the light of its own experiences and understandings, aspirations, and anxieties. Different societies, different groups within society, and even different individuals will often disagree about the meaning of events, the ways in which events happened, and even, sometimes, whether events happened at all. There is no single history that tells the whole story; there can be many different histories, telling many different stories, and many different ways of remembering, recording, and recounting the past. (2)

Calloway, Colin G. First Peoples: A Documentary Survey of American Indian History. Boston: Bedford/St. Martin's, 1999.

There's a little bit of discussion of Scots/Native American people and culture in this textbook, so it's not completely off topic. It might take a while to get the book cajunscot had suggested.