traditional vs. classic

[creagdhubh]

The post above seems to give credit to me for posting of the photo, which I did not, although I was I had ready access to such resources.

All of these photos showing the plaid are fabulous and I think the subjects in them look born to it.

My earlier statement was meant to read that [I]I[I] could not wear the garment with the type of conviction to make it work. It would appear costumish (sp) on me.

It does not change the fact that I love the look. I hope others more suited to it keep it alive as an option.

Joe

I understand.

[creagdhubh]

[QUOTE=JSFMACLJR;852784]

Actually, Kyle, Lochiel is wearing two tartans here: a kilt of Cameron tartan, and a plaid of Cameron of Lochiel, which is his personal tartan and may only be worn by Lochiel and his close family.

Oh okay. I did think that the setts looked a wee bit different. Thanks for the clarification!

[creagdhubh]

If you want to wear a shoulder plaid, "Lairds plaid" as they seem to have been christened here, then wear one. They had their uses for centuries, of that there is no doubt, but these days there are better and more efficient options to protect us from the elements. Personally I found them a damn bother for most of the time and in all honesty I think they are heading into a borderline costume situation.

I would agree that they are mainly for ornamentation these days, and there is no doubt they have an elegant and regal look about them. They could definitely be functional, but I would seriously doubt someone really using their plaid to battle the elements at a Highland games or some other social event-more or less, the person would opt, in my opinion, for an indoor escape! LOL! Everyone has their opinion and is entitled to it-that's why I love and adore this forum!

[creagdhubh]

I have a small hand drawn sketch of a g-g grandfather from the early to mid-1800s. Shows a gentleman in trousers, jacket, bonnet and plaid. He was a shepherd from the Argyll region so the plaid was likely utilitarian.

Interesting.

[creagdhubh]

Yes, I understand that this is the fashion today. But is this the way it was done in the 1800s as well?

No, not at all. It seemed like back then, any type of leather brogue was the norm. Even ankle type boots with kilt hose!

[Deil the Yin]

"Traditional Highland Dress The place to talk about traditionally made kilts and classic highland apparel and style."

I understand traditional to mean beliefs and customs that are passed down from generation to generation. This involves preservation through reproduction of the tradition.

I understand classic to mean something that is of enduring value and that meets definitive standards. This involves older, model examples but can also include new ones that are different in some way while maintaining classic values.

To the rabble I'd like to submit some thoughts for discussion:

In highland apparel and style, what is truly classic and what is traditional? Are they the same or different?

What are the sources and influences of your concept of classic?

Where does your knowledge of tradition come from i.e. who passed it down to you, who passed it down to the person who passed it down, etc?

How does a site like XMTS contribute to the maintenance or alteration of traditions and concepts of classic?

It's interesting this thread has been started as I was just thinking about the very topic not more than an hour ago...

My thoughts may not exactly answer your discussion pointes, but what I would put forward is that, in a broad sense, we can take "traditional" highland dress to be taken from the time when the kilt became the National dress for ALL of Scotland and not just the daily wear of Highlandmen, ie the era of Sir Walter Scott and King George's visit to Edinburgh. "Classic" seems to me very subjective, though I perceive that many kilt accoutrements draw from the hey day of the Highland Clan System (pre 1745) for style inspiration (eg gauntlet cuffs etc). I could be off on the "classic" aspect as I'm only going on my impression of fashion history... I'm sure Mr Newsome will wade into the fray here sooner or later to straighten things out.

Regards,
Wesley

[Tobus]

If you want to wear a shoulder plaid, "Lairds plaid" as they seem to have been christened here, then wear one. They had their uses for centuries, of that there is no doubt, but these days there are better and more efficient options to protect us from the elements. Personally I found them a damn bother for most of the time and in all honesty I think they are heading into a borderline costume situation.

Well, honestly, if one's main concern is modern efficient means of protecting from the elements, maybe the kilt itself isn't the best choice either.

But I think most people would agree there's some level of compromise between functionality and tradition. I love the traditional look of a shoulder plaid when worn wrapped around the chest (as in many of the portraits from the 1800s). But I agree it would be a bit of a bother to wear... and more so if only draped over the shoulder like a folded blanket.

The "borderline costume situation" aspect is quite a conundrum. I suppose some people could pull it off, looking marvelously traditional and like they were born to wear it. Others might look like they're wearing a costume. The difference between the two is hard to define.

[Jock Scot]

Well, honestly, if one's main concern is modern efficient means of protecting from the elements, maybe the kilt itself isn't the best choice either.

But I think most people would agree there's some level of compromise between functionality and tradition. I love the traditional look of a shoulder plaid when worn wrapped around the chest (as in many of the portraits from the 1800s). But I agree it would be a bit of a bother to wear... and more so if only draped over the shoulder like a folded blanket.

The "borderline costume situation" aspect is quite a conundrum. I suppose some people could pull it off, looking marvelously traditional and like they were born to wear it. Others might look like they're wearing a costume. The difference between the two is hard to define.

Actually in some circumstances I would back, above all else, a heavy wool traditional kilt to protect me from the elements any day.

[Highlander31]

Actually in some circumstances I would back, above all else, a heavy wool traditional kilt to protect me from the elements any day.

I agree with Jock. Where we live on the coast, we have cold driving rain that that can find its way through most clothing. I walk the hillside trails pretty much every morning. My kilt with a woolly pully keeps me warmer than trousers and long johns would.

I have posted the photo below before, however,it is a good example of our weather. It was taken moments before a squall line moved on shore.