Dear Tradionalists - That's what is called deluting the concept

[Grizzly]

I vote for the one in the middle............what? It's not a poll? Foiled again.

[adempsey10]

But it is ALSO a fashion garment and as such the fashion side of kilt wearing will cause variations in the appearance and style of the kilt. If a kilt maker decides to 'innovate' his kilt by dropping the pleats it might still be a kilt, whether your opinion says otherwise or not. The same way the model T is still considered a car. If you want to be a traditionalist, wear the traditional garb the traditional way. What happens on the 'fashion' side of kilt wearing shouldn't be of any concern to you since a tradition, by definition, is impervious to fashion trends.

There's also no need for name calling: "skirt wearing hipsters" It doesn't promote positive bonds between members. I'm proud of being a skirt wearing hipster. Now, excuse me while I go find my wayfarers.

[LitTrog]

If Ford decided to reintroduce the Model T, it could make those alonside the new Mustangs and still be considered an automobile manufacturer. If a kiltmaker decided to...innovate(?) and produce unpleated skirts, he/she would no longer be a kiltmaker. A kilt, by definition, has pleats. I have no problem with some dude wearing a skirt--my only issue would be if he tried insisting it was a kilt. I'd give him a dictionary and a sad shake of my head.

Of course, the fasion world and I are no longer on speaking terms, so I am probably missing the artful, edgy, devastatingly profound nuance.

[TheOfficialBren]

If Ford decided to reintroduce the Model T, it could make those alonside the new Mustangs and still be considered an automobile manufacturer. If a kiltmaker decided to...innovate(?) and produce unpleated skirts, he/she would no longer be a kiltmaker. A kilt, by definition, has pleats. I have no problem with some dude wearing a skirt--my only issue would be if he tried insisting it was a kilt. I'd give him a dictionary and a sad shake of my head.

Yup! This..spot on, LitTrog.

[cryptoman]

But it is ALSO a fashion garment and as such the fashion side of kilt wearing will cause variations in the appearance and style of the kilt. If a kilt maker decides to 'innovate' his kilt by dropping the pleats it might still be a kilt, whether your opinion says otherwise or not. The same way the model T is still considered a car. If you want to be a traditionalist, wear the traditional garb the traditional way. What happens on the 'fashion' side of kilt wearing shouldn't be of any concern to you since a tradition, by definition, is impervious to fashion trends.

There's also no need for name calling: "skirt wearing hipsters" It doesn't promote positive bonds between members. I'm proud of being a skirt wearing hipster. Now, excuse me while I go find my wayfarers.

Nope that was a Model T without wheels and you cannot seperate all historical bonds of a garment because history and evolution are insaperable, so the anything-goes-fashion-excuse is a bit akward. Evolution means something grows and contemporary kilts are kilts by definition and accepted as such. A kilt without pleats is not a kilt in the same way a Model T is not a car without wheels. You can delute your coffee all you want but someone has to drink it. In fact, you can call a skirt all you want, throw history overboard for being so called "fashionable" but if it has no impact on the evolution of a garment, no one buys into it. ;)

I'd say there is no need for whining over nothing, cause you are a man and not a mouse. I was refering to the anything-goes skirt wearer on another forum.

I don't want to be a traditionalist, I just cannot wait for the day someone calls a pair of jeans a kilt.

[HarveyH]

... I don't want to be a traditionalist, I just cannot wait for the day someone calls a pair of jeans a kilt.

Of course thanks to challenges to kilt makers you can indeed now get a kilt made from several pairs old jeans, although you can see that I prefer the more traditional look they are both "kilts", I agree that getting rid of the pleats rather destroys any reasonable definition of what a kilt might be ...

[Stoo]

Paul Henry kilt .... Made from jeans, saw it, looked good.
kilts have evolved through fashion materials, fastenings etc. evolution is what got us here

[Bohica]

All kilts may be skirts but not all skirts are kilts. Gotta have rear pleats.