The joys and dangers of Ebay pipes

[OC Richard]

This is one of those Ebay listings that quite possibly could be a wonderful vintage set!!

But with blurry photos and a description by somebody who obviously knows nothing about bagpipes, it's also possible that it's not what it seems.

https://www.ebay.com/itm/15470580496...gAAOSwXtthlWyx

First, L&M doesn't make bagpipes. They're a leather firm, who only made the bag. Happily L&M bags are dated so we see 1998 I think, dating when those pipes were being played. Those bags last forever so the pipes might have been played up until recently with that bag.

The projecting mounts on the bagpipes appear to be that-substance-which-must-not-be-named which in itself suggests, but doesn't prove, that the pipes aren't Pakistani. They made, and probably still make, plenty of **** mounted bagpipes in Sialkot, it's just that they don't make it over here to the USA very often, for obvious reasons.

Even if the set is a legitimate quality UK-made instrument (which I think it is) there's nothing to tell us whether it's a fullsize set or a 7/8 size set (which from c1830 to c1940 were called "halfsize" pipes by the Scottish makers, and what we mistakenly call "three-quarter size" pipes today).

In any case I've asked the seller for better photos, and for him/her to peek under the cords and look for a maker's stamp. Also to see if the pipe chanter is stamped.

The W Ross stamp is, I'm fairly certain, on the Practice Chanter. As usual the seller doesn't realise that the bagpipe and the PC are separate instruments. That PC itself is worth a few hundred dollars, I would think.

[WalesLax]

The reply and pictures I got were pretty useless - any luck yourself?

I would imagine some people either got better responses, know better what they are looking at, or feel this is a safe lottery ticket, as the pipes are now up over $600.

Rob

This is one of those Ebay listings that quite possibly could be a wonderful vintage set!!

But with blurry photos and a description by somebody who obviously knows nothing about bagpipes, it's also possible that it's not what it seems.

https://www.ebay.com/itm/15470580496...gAAOSwXtthlWyx

First, L&M doesn't make bagpipes. They're a leather firm, who only made the bag. Happily L&M bags are dated so we see 1998 I think, dating when those pipes were being played. Those bags last forever so the pipes might have been played up until recently with that bag.

The projecting mounts on the bagpipes appear to be that-substance-which-must-not-be-named which in itself suggests, but doesn't prove, that the pipes aren't Pakistani. They made, and probably still make, plenty of **** mounted bagpipes in Sialkot, it's just that they don't make it over here to the USA very often, for obvious reasons.

Even if the set is a legitimate quality UK-made instrument (which I think it is) there's nothing to tell us whether it's a fullsize set or a 7/8 size set (which from c1830 to c1940 were called "halfsize" pipes by the Scottish makers, and what we mistakenly call "three-quarter size" pipes today).

In any case I've asked the seller for better photos, and for him/her to peek under the cords and look for a maker's stamp. Also to see if the pipe chanter is stamped.

The W Ross stamp is, I'm fairly certain, on the Practice Chanter. As usual the seller doesn't realise that the bagpipe and the PC are separate instruments. That PC itself is worth a few hundred dollars, I would think.

[OC Richard]

The reply and pictures I got were pretty useless - any luck yourself?

I would imagine some people either got better responses, know better what they are looking at, or feel this is a safe lottery ticket, as the pipes are now up over $600.

I got good communication and a few better photos, I'm pretty sure it's a fullsize vintage ivory-mounted quality set.

I bid $650 but was outbid. Somebody got a nice vintage pipe for $680.

Anyhow here's another vintage Starck London set, this one missing one of the tenor drones. From the ruler I reckon it's a fullsize set.

https://www.ebay.com/itm/403310381153

Quite possibly this will be a super pipe for somebody willing to have a matching tenor made. I know Rick Pettigrew could do it.

[OC Richard]

Quite a bargain, an early Kintail set for around $750 when you reckon in the shipping:

https://www.ebay.com/itm/16527099369...AAAOSw1MphqQZT

My Pipe Major plays a 1980s silver & ivory Kintail and the tone he gets is outstanding.

The bass in particular is powerful.

I don't know a better way for somebody to get a great-sounding first set or backup set. I know the Catalin is offputting to many! But I love those old Catalin pipes.

And anyone wanting an extremely cost-effective way to get into the wonderful world of the Border Pipes here's a lovely vintage Henderson set, the size we call "three-quarter size" today but what all the Victorian and early 20th century pipe makers called "half-size" (in reality they're closer to 7/8 size).

Purchase a Border chanter, reed these drones to play in A=440, and Bob's your uncle.

https://www.ebay.com/itm/14435652838...YAAOSwTFVh05fs

I did the same, several years ago, with a vintage Glen "half-size" (7/8 size) set. Using home-made drone extenders I got the drones to play beautifully in A=440. I ended up purchasing three different "Border" chanters (by Hamish Moore, Nigel Richard, and Jon Swayne, none of whom, by the way, called their chanters "Border" chanters).

[YOJiMBO20]

Those Henderson’s look great. Unfortunately for those of us Stateside, they look to have some natural, white, dentin material that came from a large pachyderm.

[OC Richard]

Yes indeed that material in banned from crossing all International borders including the USA.

What I don't know is if, from the standpoint of CITES, the UK is part of the EU or if the EU contains International Borders.

In any case here's a nice vintage Gillanders & McLeod set at $600 with no bids.

Highland Bagpipe Makers tells us that Robert "Bert" Gillanders (b.1898) worked for the Thows then started his own business in 1926. In 1972 Iain McLeod joined the firm, the name changing to Gillanders & McLeod.

For me a seller having so few transactions is a red flag. (True that everybody has to start somewhere! But there are sellers who burn their bridges, close their account, and reappear in a new guise.)

https://www.ebay.com/itm/31383665822...UAAOSwk~1h5MZW

[Tomo]

What I don't know is if, from the standpoint of CITES, the UK is part of the EU or if the EU contains International Borders.

The EU joined in 2015 as a result of an amendment allowing regional economic integration organisations to become parties. As such (and because the EU is a free trade zone) there are no internal barriers to the movement of goods.

However, the UK has since left the EU - but is a party to CITES in its own right (as are each of the member states of the EU). This means that the trade within the EU is ok but trade between the EU and the UK is not.