Bogus commercial heraldry....

[Ozman1944]

oops! "OR Tinkers" sorry.

[gilmore]

This sort of "bucket shop" heraldry has been around for a long time. I always roll my eyes when I see the same booth at games and festivals.

...

This brings up the troubling issue of why some games and festivals allow flim flam artists like this to rent space. Has anyone ever tried talking to the organizers about this? If so, what kinds of repsonses do you get?

[SteveB]

I don't mind the vendors of this c**p. They do serve a purpose. Many a tourist has come into a festival and found some kind of emblem on a key chain, pin, or piece of paper with their surname on it and purchased it for whatever reason. Then on the way out they tend to think about it and stop into the genealogy tent. I have had the pleasure of being in the tent of The Irish Ancestral Research Association at a festival, and taken a few of the tourists on a climb of their family tree. The bucket shop c**p got their attention, and taking the c**p home and putting it above the fireplace reminds them of the research that they should really do. It has brought many into an interest in their Irish, Scot, or English family connections as stable hands for a tenant farmer in the ould sod. I look at it the same way as a tat kilt getting someone interested in kilting enough to graduate to the real deal.
I have a few of these " Arms" on display in my house as artwork, as that is all they are worth.

[Nighthawk]

Most of those websites forget to take into account different sects with the same name. The English, Scots, and Irish all had different groups that appeared throughout time with the same surname, but no relation.

Exactly! Like mine- Wolfe. There is Wolff (Irish, as in Harlan & Wolff, the ship builders of Titanic), and there is the Scottish lowland/border family (my great grandfather) and the English family (as in Colonel James of Culoden 1745 distinction- only British officer who refused direct orders to shoot wounded Jacobites.) We all come from the Saxon Wuffinga tribe, but the three really aren't directly related as far as I know. However, the English Wolfe coat of arms had some really nice elements in it, so as a graphic designer myself, I took one of those elements and adapted it to a design suitable for a (very beautiful!!) A_Hay leather sporran. And I have a traditional coat of arms- as in one that is mine and mine alone.

[Scotus]

I don't mind the vendors of this c**p. They do serve a purpose. Many a tourist has come into a festival and found some kind of emblem on a key chain, pin, or piece of paper with their surname on it and purchased it for whatever reason. Then on the way out they tend to think about it and stop into the genealogy tent. I have had the pleasure of being in the tent of The Irish Ancestral Research Association at a festival, and taken a few of the tourists on a climb of their family tree. The bucket shop c**p got their attention, and taking the c**p home and putting it above the fireplace reminds them of the research that they should really do. It has brought many into an interest in their Irish, Scot, or English family connections as stable hands for a tenant farmer in the ould sod. I look at it the same way as a tat kilt getting someone interested in kilting enough to graduate to the real deal.
I have a few of these " Arms" on display in my house as artwork, as that is all they are worth.

I respectfully disagree. While people may have gotten interested because of the bucket shops, it doesn't justify the scam they are pulling off. They say, "This is your family 'crest' [it's a coat of arms, btw]," and that fact is... it isn't. I just don't think what they do can be justified on the basis that some people might get interested in genealogy. There are still a lot of people who are going to take this stuff home, hang in on their wall (or get a tattoo ), and say, "This is my family crest."

I had to laugh at Pleater's comment:

Perhaps if you explain to your lady that the actual owner of the crest might have every right to remove if from your person she might change her mind?

Good one!

Anyway, my opinon is the same in regard to those cheep kilts, but this thread is about bogus heraldry.

[sirdaniel1975]

Some examples of Generic Scottish Heraldry. I happen to like this stuff due to its nationalistic intentions.


The thistle crest badge I mentioned.


The lion crest badge I mentioned.


A Scottish Saltire shield patch. I have one of these.

Here's a couple of cities heraldry examples. They are available in blazer crest badge patches from the Scottish Tartans Museum & Bold Blades.


City of Glasgow


Aberdeen

I used these two because these are a couple of the areas I've traced my ancestry to. I have also traced the family bloodlines to Caithness, Sutherland, and Fife.

[macwilkin]

I don't mind the vendors of this c**p. They do serve a purpose. Many a tourist has come into a festival and found some kind of emblem on a key chain, pin, or piece of paper with their surname on it and purchased it for whatever reason. Then on the way out they tend to think about it and stop into the genealogy tent. I have had the pleasure of being in the tent of The Irish Ancestral Research Association at a festival, and taken a few of the tourists on a climb of their family tree. The bucket shop c**p got their attention, and taking the c**p home and putting it above the fireplace reminds them of the research that they should really do. It has brought many into an interest in their Irish, Scot, or English family connections as stable hands for a tenant farmer in the ould sod. I look at it the same way as a tat kilt getting someone interested in kilting enough to graduate to the real deal.
I have a few of these " Arms" on display in my house as artwork, as that is all they are worth.

I would agree with Scotus and other on this; while I would never dream of telling someone what they could or couldn't hand above their mantle, the fact of the matter is, the Bucket Shops are selling arms under false pretenses, which smacks of fraud to me.

Regards,

Todd

[Scotus]

I would never dream of telling someone what they could or couldn't hand above their mantle...

Regards,

Todd

I'd be happy to do it for you.

[James MacMillan]

One thing that has been mentioned before but bears repeating.....

Just because your name is "MacRumpity" doesn't mean that you personally have any connection to the Clan "MacRumpity" - in my own case for instance, when my aunt did the research, it turned out that our closest clan tie are to two very different clan names entirely than those we have on our drivers ID's!

Please remember folks that "MacRumpity" only signifies that one of your forebearers was the Son of somebody named Rumpity.

[sirdaniel1975]

One thing that has been mentioned before but bears repeating.....

Just because your name is "MacRumpity" doesn't mean that you personally have any connection to the Clan "MacRumpity" - in my own case for instance, when my aunt did the research, it turned out that our closest clan tie are to two very different clan names entirely than those we have on our drivers ID's!

Please remember folks that "MacRumpity" only signifies that one of your forebearers was the Son of somebody named Rumpity.

So very true. Which is related in many ways to what the discussion in this thread is. The unfortunate fact is, that most people aren't willing to do the research to attempt to verify such a thing. They are more comfortable just mailing out their $20 membership fee annually.

Which brings up another issue... here's the scenario:

So you've found out your blood line doesn't tie to the clan you thought. Perhaps your blood line doesn't tie to any clan. Then be proud of whatever your bloodline ties to. Be proud to be a commoner (by commoner I mean someone who is not nobility). Wear your district tartan, use the Scotland crest badge, get your district blazer patch.

There's an old saying: You can't be somebody till you realize your nobody!