Shirts to be worn with PC jacket?

[Thistle Stop]

Does the shirt that's worn with a PC have pleats on the front or no?

The most commonly found style of formal shirt for black-tie events (evening dress) is a white wing-collar shirt with a pleated front, barrel or French cuffs that will accept cufflinks (or stud links), and black studs fastening the front. Many people call this a 'tux' shirt. It's worn under the Prince Charlie jacket and waistcoat, with a kilt, just as with a dinner jacket or other sort of 'tuxedo' jacket and trousers. It can have a plain front, but what one sees most is the pleated front, with quarter-inch pleats topping the list for popularity and availability. Very narrow pleats called pin tucks and half-inch pleats are found, too. The black tie to wear with it is a silk (or silk-like) bow tie; wool can also be found.

Piqué-fronted shirts are properly reserved for white-tie occasions, worn (of course) with a white piqué bow tie and a white piqué waistcoat -- with trousers, though the same look can be achieved with the Prince Charlie and kilt. However, it is usual for the formal kilt outfit with the Prince Charlie coatee and black 3-button waistcoat to be worn with a black tie even for white-tie events, in the same mode as a military dress uniform.

The formal military-style kilt jackets -- Montrose, Sheriffmuir, and Kenmore doublets -- require a white lace jabot at the neck, and (optionally) lace cuffs, so they are best paired with a band-collar shirt without pleats. Both the Sheriffmuir doublet and the Prince Charlie coatee can be worn with a matching 5-button waistcoat. Note that an ordinary 5-button waistcoat, or one made for an Argyll jacket, will not work with the PC jacket -- it must be made specifically for the type of jacket to be worn. Likewise, the 3-button PC waistcoat will only work with the PC jacket.

The Argyll jacket (or similar Crail or Braemar jacket -- these differ by cuff style) bridges from business attire to semi-formal dress, including most 'dressed up' daytime events. In barathea cloth it can be worn with the same type of wing-collar shirt and bow tie, or with a matching 5-button waistcoat and a long tie or ruched cravat ('scrunchy tie'). This style of jacket can be worn with a lay-down collar formal shirt, too, with either kind of tie. The tweed Argyll jacket is for non-formal daytime occasions and is normally worn with a white business-type shirt and a plain wool long tie in a colour to complement the kilt.

Tartan ties and waistcoats are generally not worn for formal or semi-formal events with the kilt, though a silk or wool tartan bow tie and cummerbund set can enliven the look of a dinner jacket and evening trousers.

Whatever you wear with your kilt, may it always be worn in good health, and with pride!

Cyndi

[Frank McGrath]

Where can one purchase dress shirts with French Cuffs. I need a shirt that I can wear with my kilt or with my tux.

Tanks, Frank

[george7]

Where can one purchase dress shirts with French Cuffs. I need a shirt that I can wear with my kilt or with my tux.

Tanks, Frank

Try Macy's or any store that carries formal wear.

[svc40bt]

Where can one purchase dress shirts with French Cuffs. I need a shirt that I can wear with my kilt or with my tux.

Tanks, Frank

Here in MD, Jos A Bank stores generally carry them. I would expect Nordstrom or other department stores to have them as well. The one I mentioned came from Nordstrom: White "royale oxford" with spread collar and french cuffs. It has regular buttons, no allowance for studs.

[Zardoz]

The first time I was putting together a 'formal' outfit, I came across this advice on the STA website;

" Shirt. You should wear a white plain style collar-attached with either a button or cuff link style cuffs. Keep it simple - no pleats at all or colour trimmings. "

Finding a reasonably priced, 'plain front' wing collar shirt locally was harder in practice than I thought, but I eventually found some at a tux rental outlet (Al's Formalwear) for about $25 new, $12 ex-hire. I later found the tall collar 'Victorian' or 'swept wing' shirt at several UK venders and ordered one here;
http://macdonald-sporrans.com/index....roducts_id=128

I like the look of the taller Victoria collar over the regular wingtip, which always looks like a band collar with little triangles sewn on to me.

[Spartan]

Where can one purchase dress shirts with French Cuffs. I need a shirt that I can wear with my kilt or with my tux.

Tanks, Frank

I've found formal shirts at Sears in the formal department. You can also check Men's Wearhouse, as they rent formal wear.

I'm careful about the word "correct," and use it carefully. Many things are a matter of preference rather than correctness. I believe that is the case with the pleated formal shirt vs. the plain front shirt. I have a pleated shirt with a wing tip collar that I use with formal wear. Now that I have a PC, I'm considering purchasing a plain front shirt, not because it's correct, but because I'm coming to believe that I will like it better with the PC.

Frank

[MacMillan of Rathdown]

I'm careful about the word "correct," and use it carefully. Many things are a matter of preference rather than correctness. I believe that is the case with the pleated formal shirt vs. the plain front shirt. I have a pleated shirt with a wing tip collar that I use with formal wear. Now that I have a PC, I'm considering purchasing a plain front shirt, not because it's correct, but because I'm coming to believe that I will like it better with the PC.

Frank

You are spot on.

[Thistle Stop]

Where can one purchase dress shirts with French Cuffs. I need a shirt that I can wear with my kilt or with my tux.

Tanks, Frank

Hi Frank -- We sell them in 100% cotton, wing collar or laydown collar, quarter-inch pleats, pearlised buttons, for $45.00 plus postage ($5.00 -- or in your case, you could pick it up since we're your local Highland dress supplier). I don't keep them in stock because there are so many neck and sleeve combinations, so if you want to buy one, let me know a few days before you actually need it so I can order it in.

Cheers,

Cyndi

[JSFMACLJR]

Tartan ties and waistcoats are generally not worn for formal or semi-formal events with the kilt, though a silk or wool tartan bow tie and cummerbund set can enliven the look of a dinner jacket and evening trousers.

Whatever you wear with your kilt, may it always be worn in good health, and with pride!

Cyndi

Where did you come up with this urban myth, Cyndi? It just isn't so! Tartan waistcoats certainly are worn in the evening. You just might not move in circles where tartan waistcoats are commonplace--and correct.

I find authoritative statements such as yours make me wince! You may not think such and such isn't worn ( and you may prefer that), but tell that to the great mass of gentlemen who think otherwise!

Best regards,
Sandford MacLean

[Thistle Stop]

Where did you come up with this urban myth, Cyndi? It just isn't so! Tartan waistcoats certainly are worn in the evening. You just might not move in circles where tartan waistcoats are commonplace--and correct.

I find authoritative statements such as yours make me wince! You may not think such and such isn't worn ( and you may prefer that), but tell that to the great mass of gentlemen who think otherwise!

Best regards,
Sandford MacLean

Hi Sandford -- What I said was 'generally not worn'. Certainly some people do wear them, but it isn't common. The original poster was asking for basic information about what's conventionally worn, so I was describing that. In my experience, most people who are just putting together a first formal ensemble want to go with something that will resemble the majority of other gents at an affair -- the basics. More individualistic expressions come later, after he has observed some variations, looked at other options, and decided what he wants to add to his wardrobe. I was aiming to be helpful, not confusing, and certainly not offensive or incorrect.

Though not a very popular jacket style, the Sheriffmuir doublet is a often worn with a 5-button tartan waistcoat, cut on the bias, with a lace jabot. While it may be considered correct, that look makes me wince! To me, it resembles nothing so much as a schoolgirl's pinafore uniform with a cardigan over it. I think a barathea or velvet waistcoat to match the doublet is a much more masculine and handsome presentation -- but that's just my opinion.

Thanks for pointing out that conventions of dress can vary from place to place. A variety of experiences and opinions is the great strength of this forum!

Cheers -- Cyndi