Diluted tartan?

[Downunder Kilt]

Consider the following tartans:


Regent? I'll bet that one has a short shelf-life.

Wellington? Named after an Irish guy with an English dukedom.

Robin Hood? Named after a legendary figure. An English legendary figure.

Meg Merrilies? Named after a fictional character.


It may be getting "worse", but the dilution has existed since the beginning of named Scottish tartans. (And there was a time before tartans were named, and a time before they were Scottish as well.)

Could you explain what you mean about the short shelf life of the Regent tartan as according to the Scottish Register of Tartans and the STA, it has been around since 1819, designed by Wilsons of Bannockburn for George IV, the Prince Regent

[figheadair]

Could you explain what you mean about the short shelf life of the Regent tartan as according to the Scottish Register of Tartans and the STA, it has been around since 1819, designed by Wilsons of Bannockburn for George IV, the Prince Regent

Not quite true. The sett was one of the Wilsons' Numbered Patterns, in this case No232, which they sold as Regent during the popular Regency era. That ended in 1820 when the Prince Regent became George IV. The tartan was recycled by Wilsons and became MacLaren by which name it is still known. Further details are in my little book on Wilsons' 1819 Key Pattern Book.

[Downunder Kilt]

Not quite true. The sett was one of the Wilsons' Numbered Patterns, in this case No232, which they sold as Regent during the popular Regency era. That ended in 1820 when the Prince Regent became George IV. The tartan was recycled by Wilsons and became MacLaren by which name it is still known. Further details are in my little book on Wilsons' 1819 Key Pattern Book.

I have no doubt that what you say is true as I have read many versions of the same. I don't know if you have read the STA and STR entries which seem to imply that it was originally taken from another tartan. I have also seen the purple based tartan referred to as the MacLaren 1819 Variant.

[figheadair]

I have no doubt that what you say is true as I have read many versions of the same. I don't know if you have read the STA and STR entries which seem to imply that it was originally taken from another tartan. I have also seen the purple based tartan referred to as the MacLaren 1819 Variant.

I'm familiar with both databases. Their inference is that the sett was previously called Regent rather than being taken from another pattern.

In essance blue and purple were interchangeable shades of blue. Wilsons of Bannockburn often used their purple (a very dark blue similar to French Blue) in their early dark patterns as opposed to using a pure indigo blue which was more expensive and which they used to call Officers' Blue. Wilsons worked with several shades of blue from purple, the darkest to sextian or light blue, the lightest. Their use of purple as their default blue shade for such designs ceased around 1830 by which time a straight indigo blue was the norm.

[Downunder Kilt]

I'm familiar with both databases. Their inference is that the sett was previously called Regent rather than being taken from another pattern.

In essance blue and purple were interchangeable shades of blue. Wilsons of Bannockburn often used their purple (a very dark blue similar to French Blue) in their early dark patterns as opposed to using a pure indigo blue which was more expensive and which they used to call Officers' Blue. Wilsons worked with several shades of blue from purple, the darkest to sextian or light blue, the lightest. Their use of purple as their default blue shade for such designs ceased around 1830 by which time a straight indigo blue was the norm.

Thanks for all that information, that's why this place is so great, you can learn new things everdayday, much obliged to you figheadair. Apologies to the OP if I highjacked the thread a bit.

[Morris at Heathfield]

Could you explain what you mean about the short shelf life of the Regent tartan as according to the Scottish Register of Tartans and the STA, it has been around since 1819, designed by Wilsons of Bannockburn for George IV, the Prince Regent

All I meant was that, once the regent becomes king, demand for a tartan named "Regent" will undoubtedly drop. Of course, as noted by Mike Oettle and Peter MacDonald, some of these tartans have been repurposed. The Regent tartan became the MacLaren clan tartan. The Robin Hood tartan is perhaps better known these days as the Rob Roy Hunting tartan. And the Meg Merrilies tartan has been adopted by the Merrilees family as their tartan. The Wellington tartan, on the other hand, seems to have dropped out of use.

I think my point is that what a tartan "means" has long been decided by the tartan manufacturers, as they're the ones who started giving them names to keep them straight, and from the beginning they didn't limit themselves to peculiarly Scottish names.

[figheadair]

I think my point is that what a tartan "means" has long been decided by the tartan manufacturers, as they're the ones who started giving them names to keep them straight, and from the beginning they didn't limit themselves to peculiarly Scottish names.

I supposed where things have changed (got out of hand?) is the sheer volume of new tartans which has grown exponentially since the very recent availability of computer, and latterly, on-line design software.

The process really got going at the end of the C18th when Wilsons of Bannockburn began to name tartans as a marketing ploy to help them sell better. Many of these early setts were named after towns and regions, and occasionally after individual's with whom they traded. Later they began to add names that were popular at the time in order to capture the public's desire to be seen to be trendy and thus they named setts after national heroes, events or characters from popular novels etc; Wellington, Waterloo, Rob Roy, Meg Merrilies etc.

The concept of clan tartans began around the same time and was part of the Highland Revival and in particular the efforts of the Highland Society of London to record and preserve the old clan tartans. This very concept was flawed but started the love affair with family identification that was built upon by Sir Walter Scott for the 1822 Levee and later broadened to a pan-Scottish symbol by the Sobieski Stuarts and later Victorians.

The casualty of the process that continues apace today were the truly old Highland tartans. A few survived as clan tartans but most fell into disuse. Those that have survived commercially have often been altered by the manufacturers to fit the needs of standard sett sizes and colours. Much of my research is concerned with finding, recording, and where possible, promoting the used of these original tartans.