Origins of septs.....

[rtc872]

Jock said it best. Apparently my family, Christie, are a sept of Farquharson. Despite this, all attempts to follow the family history lead to nowhere near the "lands" of Farquharson.

If you look here it gives some ideas of the origin but to be honest all it tells me is that my family are most likely of Norse origin or at some stage in the distant past we had a particularly fervent Christian as an ancestor and wanted Christ in his name.

I am still trying to find out if in fact our family didn't start as some form of Gilchrist. It wouldn't be hard to take the step when Anglicising to drop the "Gil" and maintain the "christ" part.

I reckon even if your name is a clan name there is no proof that some ancestor was apart of that group or was anglicised to the same name or adopted it on whim for some reason or another.

I must say though that looking through family history is fascinating and worth every effort.

[BoldHighlander]

Jock said it best. Apparently my family, Christie, are a sept of Farquharson. Despite this, all attempts to follow the family history lead to nowhere near the "lands" of Farquharson.

In my case I can trace my Macranalds back to the lands of Keppoch & the Macdonells of Keppoch (of the Clan Donald).

As for my Scobie's (Scobee's /Scoby's), we're not sure exactly where in Scotland mine are from (just the year my ancestor was born in "Scotland"). All we know is the name orginated in Perthshire, and a Scobie went north to Mackay country, married the chief's daughter, and thereafter all Scobie's are listed as septs to clan Mackay.

As for my Stewart's, Grant's, etc, I don't have enough info on those lines yet to tell one way or the other.

[MacSpadger]

I must say though that looking through family history is fascinating and worth every effort.

Yes, I agree. I have been doing the family tree for around 20 years now. I have found a few "Clan" type names, MacMillan, MacCauley, MacGrigor, Robertson, Morrison, Fraser, etc. But, in all these cases these ancestors came from areas associated with the name. My own surname seems pretty much rooted in the centre of Scotland, no Hielan' bluid, despite a plethora of books and websites saying otherwise.

I have found no geographical or family connection with the MacDonnell of Glengarry clan. At the time of Skene's book, (The Highlanders of Scotland, their Origin, History, and Antiquities; with a sketch of their manners and customs, and an account of the clans in which they were divided, and of the state of society which existed among them, published 1837), the MacDonnell chief was called Alasdair. Perhaps the sept name was appropriated to go with the chief's forename? In Innes and Adam's Clans, Septs & Regiments of the Scottish Highlands there is an accusation to some clan historians of "sept snatching".

Obviously someone sat down at some point and made these sept lists up, as seems to be happening in the recent but burgeoning Irish tartan market today. There must be many other people who have surnames appropriated as septs without knowing why. I was just wondering if anyone had any further insight into the matter.

[BoldHighlander]

Obviously someone sat down at some point and made these sept lists up, as seems to be happening in the recent but burgeoning Irish tartan market today. There must be many other people who have surnames appropriated as septs without knowing why. I was just wondering if anyone had any further insight into the matter.

I'm sorry but I have nothing to add to your query, other than somewhere I once read something that primarily agrees with Jock's suspicions.

I have also heard that (modern) clan societies influence these lists as well....in the case of Clan Donald its through genealogical research (the addition or deletion of sept/clan names). As to the how or when their list was first developed, that I couldn't tell you.

[MacSpadger]

I'm sorry but I have nothing to add to your query, other than somewhere I once read something that primarily agrees with Jock's suspicions.

I have also heard that (modern) clan societies influence these lists as well....in the case of Clan Donald its through genealogical research (the addition or deletion of sept/clan names). As to the how or when their list was first developed, that I couldn't tell you.

Oh, I have been a frequest visitor to Skye over the years and have dropped in at the Clan Donald centre many times, there's a very good annual piping comp there, and the food is superb. However, they couldn't provide me with any instances at all of Sanderson being a sept, yet it's out there in print, and has been for a long time, around 160 years.

The pedantics are mad too, Sanderson is a sept of MacDonnell, but Sandison is a sept of Clan Gunn and Saunderson is a sept of Clan MacAlister? Jings, crivvens and Help ma Boab!!

Still, it's nothing to lose sleep over. I was thinking about getting another kilt and was dithering about going for a MacDonnell of Glengarry tartan. If there was a family connection it might have influenced my choice, that's all. As it happens, this has just left me as undecided as before. Thanks.

[MacSpadger]

Just for a final bit of fun, I have taken a group of ancestral names from my family tree research, I am a direct decendent of all the names listed. It has been surprisingly easy to find "septs" for a lot of them. Really; only 10-15 mins online. My poor old G-G-Grandmother Elizabeth Paul from the Isle of Mull has a choice of 4 clans pulling at her bones. They can't all be right!!

Angus, sept of the Clan MacInnes
Allen, sept of the Clan MacFarlane
Bain, sept of the Clan MacKay
Barclay, Clan Barclay
Baxter, Clan Baxter
Bissett, Clan Bissett
Blair, Clan Blair
Cheyne, sept of the Clan Cumming
Fenton, sept of the Clan Chisholm
Fowlie, sept of Clan Munro
Fraser, Clan Fraser
Gill, sept of the Clan MacDonald
Grigor, Clan MacGregor
Gregor, Clan MacGregor
Henderson, Clan Henderson
Laing, Sept of Clan Gordon or MacDonald
McCaig, sept of Clan MacLeod
McCauley, Clan MacCauley
McMillan, Clan MacMillan
Miller, sept of Clan MacFarlane
Mitchell, sept of Clan Innes
Morison, Clan Morrison
Morrison, Clan Morrison
Paul, given variously as septs of Cameron, MacIntosh, MacKay, Mackintosh
Philip, sept of MacDonnell (of Keppoch)
Robertson, Clan Robertson
Scott, Clan Scott