The Ghillie Shirt

[CollinMacD]

First of all, I will say thank you for this information.

Second of all, it's not all fantasy. I do know history too, I know Scotland's history to a satisfactory level from ancient Caledonia to the Highland Romanticism period of the 19th Century. I think you misunderstood me, I love romanticism as well as history. I have been researching into the history of Scotland since 2016, two full years so I'm familiar with the different parts of it. I'm aware that living conditions were terrible and there was a lot of disease, terrible I know. I even said to myself a long time ago in my head "Okay, you can have a pan-Scottish identity and romanticize all you want, as long as you know the reality and history.", and this is how I view it. I know Scotland to a certain extent is a creation of the Highland Romanticism of the 19th Century, Walter Scott played a part in this. I watch Braveheart knowing it isn't true, I know both the romantic fictional Scottish Wars of Independence and the real Scottish Wars of Independence.

Patrick, with all due respect, I have been an Historian and archival researcher for over 45 years, not just 2 years. I worked for lived and researched History mainly in the US and but was in Oxford, England for four years, specifically researching on your English Civil War, "War of the Roses" . I have wrote many factual historical accounts for Ken Burns, James McPherson, Lawrence Kohl, Don Trioni, Dale Gallows, Ken Zwick (Hollywood Director) and so many others. I have lectured, researched and written historical accounts base on facts and authenticated first person accounts of the times. I have interviews people who lived through major historical events, documenting there experiences. I know my craft. I am so happy, as a young person, you are taking a very deep interest in history, but I think you need to have a more open mind, many more years of experience, understand real archival research methods, and know how to separate real history for history based on historic facts, or as we say, History used as a backdrop for fictional situations. History is much more complex then just dates, times and places. I am not ringing my own bell, I am just offering you advice from a person who has walked this walk before you were born. Trust me, Walter Scott is not an Historian, but a author of Historical Novels, Sir Walter Scott is history himself because of the affect his works had on his readers and revitalized Highland Romance, not the History. He used history to tell a fictional story of romance, adventure and intrigue, he did not record or document actual historical events. Big difference. Also, if I may be so frank, as a person who went to war in Viet Nam, no war is romantic. I hope you take this helping you understand. Thank you for reading my post and I am signing off.

[YOJiMBO20]

Excuse me?

I like both outfits. I just think the first one is a bit bland and boring. The second stands out more and is more Scottish looking, at least to me. You may see different.

So let me get this straight.

You feel that Rod Stewart wearing a kilt looking like he's coming from a costume shop is better dressed than His Royal Highness Prince Charles, Duke of Rothesay?

What exactly about what Rod is wearing makes it look more Scottish than HRH?

[PatrickHughes123]

So let me get this straight.

You feel that Rod Stewart wearing a kilt looking like he's coming from a costume shop is better dressed than His Royal Highness Prince Charles, Duke of Rothesay?

What exactly about what Rod is wearing makes it look more Scottish than HRH?

It stands out more. You'd need to be to understand. I'm not saying the other one is terrible, I just prefer the second picture. Rod Stewart's outfit looks beautiful to me.

The only criticism I have of the second is that his brogues are tied too high. I'm sure you'll agree with that.

[YOJiMBO20]

But how does it stand out more?

Is it simply because it's a brighter tartan?

Or that his ghillie brogues are tied like gladiator sandals? That his kilt doesn't fit him correctly? That his hose are too high? That his jacket sleeves are too long? Or just that he's wearing what is essentially a black-tie shirt and jacket with no tie and his shirt unbuttoned?

[PatrickHughes123]

But how does it stand out more?

Is it simply because it's a brighter tartan?

Or that his ghillie brogues are tied like gladiator sandals? That his kilt doesn't fit him correctly? That his hose are too high? That his jacket sleeves are too long? Or just that he's wearing what is essentially a black-tie shirt and jacket with no tie and his shirt unbuttoned?

Okay, you've made your point.

Yes, it is the tartan, it's also the sporran and belt, his sporran is a lot better than the other one.

[YOJiMBO20]

Okay, you've made your point.

Yes, it is the tartan, it's also the sporran and belt, his sporran is a lot better than the other one.

So you prefer bright tartans and dress sporrans. Look past that to see how each man is wearing his kilt.

If it helps, here's a link to a pic of HRH in Royal Stewart and a dress sporran. As before, dressed much better than Roddy there. https://media.gq.com/photos/57d2f47c...rles-gandy.jpg

[PatrickHughes123]

So you prefer bright tartans and dress sporrans. Look past that to see how each man is wearing his kilt.

If it helps, here's a link to a pic of HRH in Royal Stewart and a dress sporran. As before, dressed much better than Roddy there. https://media.gq.com/photos/57d2f47c...rles-gandy.jpg

Oh yeah, now I see it, it's awful.

Yeah, that link you sent, that is a great look.

[John_Carrick]

I love Rod Stewart to bits, but Prince Charles is one very well dressed gentleman!

[Jock Scot]

So you prefer bright tartans and dress sporrans. Look past that to see how each man is wearing his kilt.

If it helps, here's a link to a pic of HRH in Royal Stewart and a dress sporran. As before, dressed much better than Roddy there. https://media.gq.com/photos/57d2f47c...rles-gandy.jpg

Well done laddie! A brilliant series of posts.

[Pleater]

One of the basic problems with wearing the kilt is that it is a garment from a northern climate, and from a time when a shirt was something worn to go to bed, and then covered over by the layers put on over it to keep warm. The shirt might be revealed on a hot day when stripping off to do manual labour - or perhaps if intending to fight a duel or larger battle, but the garment called a ghillie shirt is something more in the style of the 1960s, and it is worn in the style of that decade.

Personally, I think that the kilt is clothing, and should be worn as it deemed appropriate by the wearer. It is not an anachronism but a garment well suited to the changing climate of today, and as fit to be worn casually in high summer, for work, or whatever else as with more formal clothes for weddings or funerals, warm hose and jersey, even a plaid for cooler days.

I have made a fair amount of costume over the years - I was a camp follower of John Lilburn's regiment of musket and pike, did a few things for amateur dramatics and adverts, the last things were a jedi robe, a pink cosy for a phone box outside BBC broadcasting house to advertise the Clangers, and some waistcoats for morris dancers - the basis of the design of all of them is that they need to be apt for the situation. The apricot bloomers for Widow Twankie have to be comical, the Jedi robe has to be huge and loose fitting but stay on without a fastening until the moment it is discarded.

Trying to confer upon the kilt a rigid set of rules as to what is the correct manner of dressing - well - you might as well try to herd cats. Yes there are distinct styles and conventions for some places and situations, but a man in a kilt and pair of sandals is adequately dressed for some and in full fig with dirk and feather bonnet might not be quite correct without some small change or addition for others.