I Joined my clan society

[McMurdo]

Good idea. Once you have done your chart, you might also want to go to www.rootsweb.com, search for their McMurdo message board and mailing list, and post it there.

That would work if McMurdo was my surname, however it is my middle name, for the surname see the certificate in post one.

[gilmore]

That would work if McMurdo was my surname, however it is my middle name, for the surname see the certificate in post one.

Yes, sorry, I noticed after I posted that.

I went to rootsweb.com and though there is neither a message board nor a mailing list for Allardyce, the name comes up in searches quite a few times. "McMurdo" has a message board.

You might also try a search at http://www.familysearch.org the LDS site. It has some public records, but their lineages should be verified independently before accepting them.

Good luck.

[McMurdo]

thanks for the links Gilmore.

[gilmore]

As well you should. Being English we don't have clans or this sense of history. I might be a distant relative of the Harmsworth newspaper barrons from the turn of the last century and likewise the Harmsworth Trophy. Then again if I am then I'd be related to a nazi sympathizer at a time when Dad and his two brothers marched off to war. Would I be prepared for those skeletons?

As we say in genealogical circles, you can pick your nose, and you can pick your relative's nose, but you can't pick your relatives.

It could be worse.

I have an American-born friend, whose parents are both from Lithuanian families, but one is gentile and the other Jewish. It is not at all unlikely that some of her father's relatives murdered some of her mother's relatives in the Holocaust.

Last week I discovered that we are 8th cousins twice removed to Lyndon Baines Johnson. None of my relatives so far has been impressed. In fact they kind of moan on hearing the news. One calls him "that man from Texas."

Earlier this year I uncovered something scandalous about my grandparents and made the mistake of sharing it with a cousin who I thought was level-headed. She hasn't spoken to me nor my immediate family since.

[Mike1]

My problem is with the statement "if you are interested in your family history I would say the first step to a larger world would be to join your clan society," which is quite unrealistic. The standard and accepted practice of genealogical research is starting with one's immediate family and working backward, generation by generation. Trying to take short cuts almost always leads to trouble at some point in the future. (The one exception is the possibility of DNA testing's being helpful.)

And you know if McMurdo has, in fact, started with his immediate family and worked backward, generation by generation, to discover his connection to the Grahams is quite real, then his statement would make a lot of sense. If the Clan Graham Society is, indeed, 'his clan society', then he has just uncovered an exciting new way to learn about his family.

Nor do I have problems with people joining clan societies. I once joined one myself. But face it, they are simply organizations for people who happen to bear the same surname, through accidents of birth and history.

No doubt joined on a drunken dare, eh?

For someone who is so insistent on careful research and study, you are certainly quick to group all clan societies under one umbrella. Although I would agree that most people are accidents of birth, although there will be those that were carefully planned out and conceived at just the precise moment specified.

My problem is with these claims and methodologies being taken seriously, passed on to those of us doing serious genealogical work, and wasting our time.

Ahhhh, so now I understand. You are a Graham descendant, yourself. And rather than asking how McMurdo came to his genealogical conclusions, you're just assuming he is wasting your time. Now I understand your motive. you're bound to lose years of research by taking the time to prove or disprove McMurdo's genealogy, aren't you?

If I wanted to be argumentative and puncture a few Brigadoonish fantasies, I would insist that the vast majority of Scots were Lowlanders descended from Anglo-Saxon-Jute Northumbrians who never spoke a word of Gaelic, were never part of the clan system, whose surnames were never associated with a clan, and looked down on the Highland clans as uncouth barbarians. But I wont.

That would not be argumentative, that would be historically accurate.

Spouting off about McMurdo's comments without having any proof or evidence of how extensively he has examined his own lineage? Now that was being argumentative. And you are finished being argumentative, aren't you? Begging your pardon, I just realized I phrased that as a question. Let me try again. You are finished being argumentative.

[gilmore]

And you know if McMurdo has, in fact, started with his immediate family and worked backward, generation by generation, to discover his connection to the Grahams is quite real, then his statement would make a lot of sense. If the Clan Graham Society is, indeed, 'his clan society', then he has just uncovered an exciting new way to learn about his family....

No doubt joined on a drunken dare, eh?

For someone who is so insistent on careful research and study, you are certainly quick to group all clan societies under one umbrella. Although I would agree that most people are accidents of birth, although there will be those that were carefully planned out and conceived at just the precise moment specified.

Ahhhh, so now I understand. You are a Graham descendant, yourself. And rather than asking how McMurdo came to his genealogical conclusions, you're just assuming he is wasting your time. Now I understand your motive. you're bound to lose years of research by taking the time to prove or disprove McMurdo's genealogy, aren't you?

That would not be argumentative, that would be historically accurate.

Spouting off about McMurdo's comments without having any proof or evidence of how extensively he has examined his own lineage? Now that was being argumentative. And you are finished being argumentative, aren't you? Begging your pardon, I just realized I phrased that as a question. Let me try again. You are finished being argumentative.

I didn't join the clan society in question on a drunken dare. I joined it through relying on unsound, ficticious information that a relative was fond of proclaiming as truth.

I am not concerned with McMurdo wasting my time. In fact I am happy for him. I am, however, greatly concerned generally with those who pass on unsound methodology and the information gained through it as if it were reliable. You see, the pool of genealogical information is relied upon by many researchers. If it is polluted, bad info is passed on and on, and it takes longer and longer to clear up. I feel that those of us who do genealogy have a responsibility to other researchers and to our families to exercise prudence and use the best methodologies we can.

My point is simply as you quoted it above: "My problem is with the statement "if you are interested in your family history I would say the first step to a larger world would be to join your clan society," which is quite unrealistic. The standard and accepted practice of genealogical research is starting with one's immediate family and working backward, generation by generation. Trying to take short cuts almost always leads to trouble at some point in the future. (The one exception is the possibility of DNA testing's being helpful.)"

[McMurdo]

My point is simply as you quoted it above: "My problem is with the statement "if you are interested in your family history I would say the first step to a larger world would be to join your clan society,"

Gilmore, Please read this again You are saying you have a problem with my opinion, read it again, I said "I would say" meaning it is my opinion, last time I checked I was still allowed my own opinion, now stop beating a dead horse, we all know how you feel.

I did not intend this post to be a pi$$ing contest, I was just very excited about joining up with my Clan society, and yes have no fear I have gone back through the people in my family and have joined the correct Clan Society. There have also been other members of my family who have done quite a bit of research on our history, I think every family has at least one my family has a few. I will send in my information to the society and see what they come up with.

[ccga3359]

...the vast majority of Scots were Lowlanders descended from Anglo-Saxon-Jute Northumbrians who never spoke a word of Gaelic, were never part of the clan system, whose surnames were never associated with a clan, and looked down on the Highland clans as uncouth barbarians. But I wont.

Ah yes, so true. There are two people in this world. There are the English and then there are those whom wish they were English .

[The F-H.C.A.G.]

Grow up guys!

Be well,

[Monkey@Arms]

Spouting off about McMurdo's comments without having any proof or evidence of how extensively he has examined his own lineage? Now that was being argumentative. And you are finished being argumentative, aren't you? Begging your pardon, I just realized I phrased that as a question. Let me try again. You are finished being argumentative.

Actually, Gilmore didn't say anything about McMurdo's research or clan affiliation. He only gave an informed opinion about the advice in the first post about what a good "first step" about learning about your greater family would be.

And you are finished being argumentative, aren't you? Begging your pardon, I just realized I phrased that as a question. Let me try again. You are finished being argumentative.

Does that mean you're done brow-beating contributing members of this forum whose views differ from your own?

Best regards,

Jake