Ancient Order of Hibernians

[IrishGodfather]

OK, so I have a big question...Why can't a good protestant Irish guy like me join the Ancient Order of Hibernians???

I spoke with them at the highland games in Greenville last year, and they informed me of this, but why should they keep excluding protestants? I mean I'm not offended, just confused that they don't include all Irish loving people that can prove their Irish heritage...Especially since Irish patriots like Wolfetone and Robert Emmet were protestants...oh well, just thought I'd ask if anyone knew why.

-Chris

[Chas]

Hi Godfather,

This link might help:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ancient..._of_Hibernians

There is absolutely no need to keep the discrimination going, but it becomes one of those traditions that cannot be broken because 'we've always done it'.

Regards

Chas

[Colonel MacNeal]

The Hibernators are essentially an Irish Catholic organization, so you have as much chance of joining the Knights of Columbus.

[Zardoz]

The Hibernators are essentially an Irish Catholic organization, so you have as much chance of joining the Knights of Columbus.

That's the fact of it. They are a group for Catholic Irish Americans. The AOH in Houston has largely been superceeded in the Irish community by more inclusive organisations. If you look around your area there might be some other Irish heritage groups you can look at.

[Galician]

I'm just curious, my understanding from the Irish with whom I grew up is that Protestant Irish are descendents of Scots who migrated/were forced to Ireland. Does this jibe with your own family history?

[Colonel MacNeal]

I'm just curious, my understanding from the Irish with whom I grew up is that Protestant Irish are descendents of Scots who migrated/were forced to Ireland. Does this jibe with your own family history?

Indeed, but there were also Protestants who were descended from Anglo-Saxons immigrants in Ireland, as well as those descended from the Anglo-Norman ruling class.

[Woodsheal]

What's interesting to me - getting away from the religious/political aspect of things! - is that here in my area the Hibernians are a dynamic, thriving, active, growing organization, as opposed to our local Scottish Society, which is a declining (dying, actually!), moribund group composed of elderly folks with little or no interest in activities which could actually promote recognition of Scottish culture, contributions, etc.

For example, our monthly kilt night, which I've tried to promote to the Scottish Society as a perfect opportunity to gain visibility - and perhaps recruit younger members - is largely ignored by the fuddy-duddy membership who apparently prefer to let their kilts gather dust in the closet.

Why is the Irish-American community so much MORE dynamic than the Scottish-American...?

[Colonel MacNeal]

What's interesting to me - getting away from the religious/political aspect of things! - is that here in my area the Hibernians are a dynamic, thriving, active, growing organization, as opposed to our local Scottish Society, which is a declining (dying, actually!), moribund group composed of elderly folks with little or no interest in activities which could actually promote recognition of Scottish culture, contributions, etc.

For example, our monthly kilt night, which I've tried to promote to the Scottish Society as a perfect opportunity to gain visibility - and perhaps recruit younger members - is largely ignored by the fuddy-duddy membership who apparently prefer to let their kilts gather dust in the closet.

Why is the Irish-American community so much MORE dynamic than the Scottish-American...?

Without indulging in broad stereotypes, let's just say the the Irish tend to be more extroverted, and Scots in general tend to be more introverted. The Irish also have a stronger sense of cultural identity because of religion, famine, and a history of suffering from oppression. Certainly, the Scots have suffered from oppression as well, but not to the same extent as the Irish.

I better stop now.

[IrishGodfather]

Well my dad's side were protestants from Scotland who moved into Northern Ireland during the plantation period, but my mom's side are from Co. Offaly, and I have no idea if they were catholic in ireland, but when they cam to America they became protestant, since there weren't many catholic churches in Beaufort, SC.

I don't see it as discrimination, I just wish they'd let protestants who love Ireland and its history join also. Many Irish protestants were involved in fighting the British and ensuring Irish history and culture were protected, such as the United Irishmen.

[macwilkin]

Well my dad's side were protestants from Scotland who moved into Northern Ireland during the plantation period, but my mom's side are from Co. Offaly, and I have no idea if they were catholic in ireland, but when they cam to America they became protestant, since there weren't many catholic churches in Beaufort, SC.

I don't see it as discrimination, I just wish they'd let protestants who love Ireland and its history join also. Many Irish protestants were involved in fighting the British and ensuring Irish history and culture were protected, such as the United Irishmen.

Remember, though, that you're talking about the leadership of the United Irishmen, and not the whole picture. Sympathy for the United Irishmen declined after '98 rebellion, and most Protestant Ulstermen remained loyal to the Crown. One or two Presbyterians in the ranks does not mean that all Ulster Presbyterians were United Irishmen.

Americans tend to view Irish history through romantic lenses, but if your people were Ulster-Scots Protestants from the SC Backcountry, I wouldn't expect them to want to willingly join the AOH.

Perhaps this discussion would be better seved in PMs, as we are skirting forum rules regarding religious discussions and discussions of "The Troubles".

Regards,

Todd